please empty your brain below
I am with you all the way and have another 10 years of curmudgeonliness on you.

Nick | 05.06.15 - 7:25 a.m. | #

Worryingly, i would say it's about as high at 80% of the population that don't push their chair in.

Geofftech | Homepage | 05.06.15 - 7:40 a.m. | #

Have you just come to this realisation of this imperfect world,DG? Thoughtlessness has always been around,but is growing in strength in this ' me first' time.

Jo W | 05.06.15 - 7:44 a.m. | #

You have a wonderful turn of phrase - "hot spreadsheet action". :-)

Thankfully I don't have to worry about negotiating "not pushed back" chairs in office cubby holes nor refereeing the "office layout" bunfight whenever we moved offices. The most thankless task ever.

PC | 05.06.15 - 7:50 a.m. | #

"I am increasingly convinced that the population divides into those who think about other people and those who don't."

Yep. And it's getting worse by the week.

I am increasingly convinced that the concept of 'selfish' is directly correlated to that of the 'selfie'.

That is, the more 'selfies' you take, the more selfish you are, and the less you think of/care about other people and their needs, rather than always putting your own wants and desires first.

So convinced am I that this is a genuine and useful correlation, if one says, when meeting someone for the first time, "What do you think of selfies?" then one can save a lot of time... if you like them, then I'm unlikely to like you.

Blue Witch | Homepage | 05.06.15 - 8:06 a.m. | #

I'm with you on the 'selfies' observation.

diamond geezer | 05.06.15 - 8:37 a.m. | #

At the risk of thread drift ... but in tune with the discussion re selfishness, I'm interested to know about thank you emails. If someone has done something for me I always thank them. As in, someone just fixed a glitch with an on-line data base and I emailed to thank them and wish them a nice weekend. Took maybe 30 seconds, max. But I often do substantial things for people and never hear a peep. Not a thank you nor any follow up to let me know what ended up transpiring with what I helped them with. Often it isn't even the thank you - more like if I set up person x with an opportunity at y I'd like to know what ended up happening. I've noticed it when I buy coffee too - they call my name and my chosen coffee and I accept the cup and say 'thank you!' ... whereas those before me simply take the cup from someone's hands without a murmur. I also think this is age-related. Are the chair incidents linked with gender? I'm curious because I have noticed this with men in meetings. I often have to shift three chairs to get out of a room whilst the three trousers who were sitting in them are already in the lift on the way down, networking.

Antipodean | 05.06.15 - 8:53 a.m. | #

Now you've got me wondering whether I push my desk chair in or not normally... I am not sure I actually know. Glerk.

Still, at least you've not been hotdesked. We're about to move buildings and there will be desks at a ratio of 10 to 13 people. Get in early if you want to sit at the same spot every day...

Andrew Bowden | Homepage | 05.06.15 - 9:10 a.m. | #

Hurrah for the chair pusher-inners! I hadn't made the connection between chair leaver-outers and the selfie generation. At the risk of extending this linkage, I would suggest that these despicable types are the same people who always put themselves at the front of sentences, in the way of "Me and my friend went out to an amazing club", rather than "My friend and I went.....".

I was always told that it was polite to put the other person first, but I am getting increasinly irritated by the growing number of Me-first types these days.

Perhaps I'm turning into a grumpy old geezer myself !

Petras409 | 05.06.15 - 9:22 a.m. | #

the problem is...

a) young people
b) "the apprentice"
c) smartphones
d) "luxury" apartments
e) young people

dave | 05.06.15 - 9:24 a.m. | #

Gosh, you are all such exemplary people.

Chris | 05.06.15 - 9:25 a.m. | #

@ Dave ... no, honestly, I find chair pushing to be positively associated with maleness and not age!

Antipodean | 05.06.15 - 9:32 a.m. | #

To see how utterly selfish many people are, go out on a rainy day and see how people wield their umbrellas, without a care whether the spikes will cut your face or puncture your eyes... Few attempt to raise the thing above face-level when encountering other people..

Alex McKenna | 05.06.15 - 9:36 a.m. | #

"I am increasingly convinced that the population divides into those who think about other people and those who don't. The latter grouping are those who stand in doorways to check their phone and those who trail wheelie suitcases behind them without a thought. They're those who . . ."

Are, unfortunately, on the increase. They also don't seem to think. Not just about other people but about anything.

Bronchitikat | Homepage | 05.06.15 - 10:13 a.m. | #

Thinking further, I reckon that the chair pushing in is directly linked to most young people no longer eating every meal sitting at a table, with other family members (ie what used to be called 'socialisation' of children).

As a child, when one asked to leave the table after eating, one was always told, "Yes, but tuck your chair in."

Similarly, I've been in many schools where, when the bell for lesson change rings, students immediately exit the classroom at speed, without pushing their chairs in (and without being told to). In my day, one wouldn't have dared to rise from one's seat before the teacher had given permission, let alone try to leave with chairs left out.

Blue Witch | Homepage | 05.06.15 - 10:35 a.m. | #

Barbecues are bonfires for food. They should be licenced so only those who can use them properly are allowed to cook on them.

Bill Matters | 05.06.15 - 10:39 a.m. | #

Smirks malevolently....it has been known for B to 'arrange' the chairs to wondrous effect. B is a pusher-in of course!

B | 05.06.15 - 11:23 a.m. | #

I am increasingly concerned that the population divides itself into
.
.
.
.
.
those who divide the population into two, based on some "key" characteristic like chair-tucking or selfie-taking
.
.
and those who do not, but are prepared to learn to know each new met-person as an individual, without putting them into a preconceived box.

I would like to be in the second category, but, as you can tell from what I am writing, I have elements of the first....

Malcolm | 05.06.15 - 11:36 a.m. | #

At the risk of sounding contrary, I have to beg to differ on all these "people are getting more selfish" comments.

There have always been selfish people; more often it's just thoughtlessness which isn't the same thing. And people have always complained about the "me first" generation.

I can remember people lamenting it for at least 30 years, and there's plenty of evidence of exactly the same complaints having been made back to Roman times.

If there's one thing that has been with us as long as there have been thoughtless people, it's people who self-righteously draw attention to the fact while smugly asserting their own superiority.

CWD | 05.06.15 - 11:38 a.m. | #

"I am increasingly convinced that the population divides into those who think about other people and those who don't"

Agree completelty, and also with Blue Witch's comments above about selfies.

My own thoughts are that you can tell who falls into which camp on a semi-crowded train. As it becomes obvious that a train is filling up, some people will leave the seat next to them clear for others to sit down, whole those on the other side of the population divide will leave a bag/coat whatever on the seat next to them, and/or spread their legs out, or whatever it takes to dissuade anyone from sitting next to them until it's the very last seat left free.

Jonathan | 05.06.15 - 11:38 a.m. | #

All this has reminded me of trying to get on a shuttle train, once, at Gatwick Airport, to get to an outbound flight.
I was near the back of the queue and it was starting to look fairly but only because some people - one in particular - was making little effort to make any space.
One guy suggested to me "You might have to push a bit" to which I jovially replied "Don't worry, I'll just kick them"
It's always stuck in my mind how it was 'the one in particular' who instantly responded with "Oh no you won't!"
Funny how she (yes, she) knew exactly who I was referring to. I wasn't sure which to like less, the conceit or the humourlessness.

RogerW | 05.06.15 - 12:54 p.m. | #

(that should be fairly full)

RogerW | 05.06.15 - 12:55 p.m. | #

Oh don't get me started on politeness, especially when connected to queuing at bus stops (or rather the lack of), or small children taking up a seat instead of the parent having them sit on their lap when it gets crowded (it's not like they even have to pay for their seat either!) and those who don't clear their table when they've finished eating!

If I've succeeded at nothing else as a parent, at least mine know to clear their table and push their chairs in when eating in fast food/cafes - even if the sound of 5 teens/young adults' chairs scraping makes the entire patronage turn round to stare at the noise! :D

Cornish Cockney | 05.06.15 - 1:45 p.m. | #

You should call your local LFB station and ask them to pop round - sounds like your desks are too close together to allow for a safe evacuation in an emergency.

Roy | 05.06.15 - 2:06 p.m. | #

Oh, seats on the train!

In addition to some people being unaware that seats are for people not bags or coats, so many people sit on the aisle seat, forcing the next person to ask them to move to get past. I usually choose a window seat, and leave the nice seat next to me vacant for the next person.

As for people moving down when the carriage is full (or, more often, failing to move down) ...

Andrew | 05.06.15 - 2:07 p.m. | #

DG, as usual you are dead right, too many people are either deliberately selfish or utterly thoughtless. My bete noire are people who never acknowledge you holding a door for them. My trick: if no word of thanks from someone following you through a door you have held, stop dead immediately and suddenly lurch heavily backwards, right into the ill mannered oik, accompanied by 'terribly sorry old chap, never saw you'! Manners were taught by many parents but not enough: even in a restaurant where there are waiters, I always put my chair back in.

Julian | 05.06.15 - 3:13 p.m. | #

I take great delight in selecting a seat on the train that has someone's briefcase, laptop or whatever on it. It's a seat, not a bloody table.
They no doubt think I'm an arse, but I don't give a toss.

Chris | 05.06.15 - 4:39 p.m. | #

I obviously push my chair in, since I'm a reasonably intelligent grown-up human being.

As such, I'm also not incapable of moving a simple chair out my way without writing a ranty blog post about it. Or heaven forbid interacting with another human being.

Curmudgeonly is one thing. Self-righteous plonker is quite another.

Simon | 05.06.15 - 4:48 p.m. | #

I think you've undermined your own argument there Simon.

A | 05.06.15 - 5:01 p.m. | #

Wow...imagine that, sitting done whilst working. Bet people on their feet most of their working day have to find something else to moan about.

Grumpy Anon | 05.06.15 - 6:51 p.m. | #

I don't think of pushing my work chair in, but I only really stand on the tube so others can sit. What does that make me? Is there any other sign I can self-check to see if I'm a polite person? For sure I'll be checking my chair now!

SJM | 05.06.15 - 10:48 p.m. | #

Re Roy’s comment at 2:06pm, and purely in the interests of safety research, perhaps DG should start a small fire in his rubbish bin.

Great Aunt Annie | 05.06.15 - 11:29 p.m. | #

Amazing how these days the definition of 'ethical' has come to define our consumer choices, rather than behaviours like those you describe.

Victor meldrew | 06.06.15 - 8:09 a.m. | #

I'm sorry to say that if your office is like mine, the next step is narrower desks. I moved to a new office and was struck by how close my elbows were to my colleagues' and discovered that the desks were 1200mm wide (ie left to right) compared to the previous 1800mm.

PeterCS | 06.06.15 - 11:19 a.m. | #

Offices treat people more and more like battery hens, and they at least have minimum space standards. Has anybody studied how output diminishes with less space to work? It sounds as if your efficiency has been seriously diminished by this move. More time spent juggling papers and keyboard, more time spent negotiating the chair hurdles and squeezing between the desks.

Nigel | 06.06.15 - 4:04 p.m. | #

@Andrew
"so many people sit on the aisle seat"
On my line, the legroom is so tight I have to sit sideways, which is only possible in the aisle seats.

@Chris
"It's a seat, not a bloody table.
They no doubt think I'm an arse, "
Well, arses are what the seats are for!

@DG
"much further away from the noisy cow in the corner"
I do hope she doesn't read your blog, or if she does, doesn't recognise it as yours.

timbo | 06.06.15 - 9:10 p.m. | #

@Andrew
I'm someone who chooses an aisle seat rather than a window seat if I can. If I have the choice, why should I go for the option I dislike just so someone else doesn't have to actually talk to me by asking to sit in the window seat?

al | 06.06.15 - 10:53 p.m. | #

Trains? Consideration for others?

One word:

Manspreading.

Richard M | 07.06.15 - 9:25 a.m. | #

People standing on the tube when there are empty seats used to really annoy me, as it takes up space unnecessarily and makes the train more crowded than it needs to be.

I'm one of those people who sits in an aisle seat because I hate feeling trapped in the corner. As more people seem to prefer window seats, I don't feel bad about it, and of course I'm happy to pay the price of moving when someone wants to take the vacant window seat. What I observed over many years of commuting, is that people found it easier to ask me to get up and move, than to ask someone to move their bags.

Sarah | Homepage | 07.06.15 - 9:50 p.m. | #

If you're having to rearrange papers constantly in order to type DG, then you should request a workspace assessment immediately. Your employer is required to make reasonable arrangements to allow you work without it impacting on your health and wellbeing.

s | 08.06.15 - 10:22 a.m. | #

This seems to be a very London-centric debate. Get out to the country you guys! Then you have all the space you need - except then you get all other kinds of stuff...like no trains, no jobs, no mobile phone reception etc.

Clive | 09.06.15 - 7:46 a.m. | #











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