please empty your brain below
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I thought Tfl Rail aka Elizabeth line was part of National Rail just like London Overground.
100andthirty | 04.12.19 - 7:09 a.m. | #
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Hope this doesn't spell the end for the Thames Branches Day Ranger!
Angus | 04.12.19 - 7:23 a.m. | #
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The word Slough actually covers part of its national rail sign. Surely they could move it a pixel or two?
Jimmy | 04.12.19 - 7:44 a.m. | #
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"Residents of Taplow, Burnham, Langley, Iver and West Drayton no longer have National Rail trainsc
Erm - yes they do. Crossrail/Elizabeth Line is part of the National Rail network.
Greg | 04.12.19 - 8:25 a.m. | #
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The map makes Heathrow and Reading each appear to be about the same distance from Hayes & Harlington. Couldn't the Piccadilly Line have been tweaked a little to make Heathrow appear further north?
David | 04.12.19 - 8:34 a.m. | #
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If anything it puts the Thames (and Greenford) branches into an information no mans land (the phrase 'no platforming' comes to mind), yes they'll appear on the bigger London's Rail & Tube Services map, but the three Thames branches are part of the ecosystem, hopefully they'll eventually be integrated into the TfL ticketing system once it's been upgraded.
Still Anon | 04.12.19 - 8:39 a.m. | #
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As an under-performing railway in London, the Greenford Line might have been an even better candidate for Overgrounding than Romford-Upminster
Max Roberts | 04.12.19 - 8:50 a.m. | #
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I don't care what about all the nay-sayers. It's Christmas, I'm a tube-nerd and I've got a new tube map.
Life is good.
Jon Jones | 04.12.19 - 8:58 a.m. | #
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I like the 'dangleway' being on the Tube map. We've travelled on it twice and used our Oyster cards and it cost nothing like £7. It is also used by commuters. I am very well informed about London public transport as I spent 5 days in London this year.
Andrew | Homepage | 04.12.19 - 9:51 a.m. | #
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The Greenford line probably would have been overgrounded if the Overground had any suitable trains, but the only other Overground line that required diesel traction (the "Goblin") has recently been electrified. It is for a similar reason that the Emerson Park line is an isolated part of the Overground rather than District or TfL Rail - only Overground trains are short enough to fit its platforms.
timbo | 04.12.19 - 10:11 a.m. | #
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There could be a 3D effect to the roundel in the JPG tweeted by Geoff. The roundel blogged by Ian looks different (normal / 2D). It's Christmas for roundel nerds as well.
R. | 04.12.19 - 10:12 a.m. | #
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I had hoped that Beck’s nice ‘TO’ box would return to show the Reading line...but of course that would have been elegant and minimalistic!
Anonymous | 04.12.19 - 10:14 a.m. | #
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So now we have river piers, the Dangleway, Reading, Cheshunt and Shenfield on the Tube Map, but STILL no Thameslink core as that's not TfL...
Mikey C | 04.12.19 - 10:20 a.m. | #
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This map marks a sad change for St John's Wood, which loses its distinctiveness. Slough has no letters in common with mackerel either.
HTFB | 04.12.19 - 11:01 a.m. | #
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a) Slough and Mackerel both contain an L.
b) The famous 'mackerel' fact only applies to the tube. Hoxton has been on the map since 2010.
diamond geezer | Homepage | 04.12.19 - 11:04 a.m. | #
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Suprised Millbank Pier is not close enough to Pimlico. I am quick walker but can do it in 5 mins.
dg writes: It's 800m on foot.
Mark Cooper | 04.12.19 - 11:08 a.m. | #
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Oops!
HTFB | 04.12.19 - 11:16 a.m. | #
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As I just posted on another site - Tube Map; never carry one - live 'sarf of da rivah' - so for me it's the slightly larger London's Rail and Tube Services Map. It does what it says on the cover.
Dave | 04.12.19 - 1:04 p.m. | #
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Look out for a new Piccadilly line in-car diagram (seems v.rare at the moment) - there's more of this kind of nonsense going on on it...
MarcB | 04.12.19 - 1:23 p.m. | #
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I’ve spent over an hour looking for that in-car diagram. No luck yet.
diamond geezer | Homepage | 04.12.19 - 1:31 p.m. | #
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It's all becoming rather messy. Anyone who needs to use a tube map wants to know the best way to get around, rather than which quango the lines are operated by. Omission of Thameslink and other NR lines is misleading, and the average London visitor does not intend to go to Reading, even if it is next door to Northolt.
kev | 04.12.19 - 2:29 p.m. | #
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It's getting to the point that there's so much information on the tube map they need one map for zones 1 & 2 and another map for the rest of the system.
Adrian | 04.12.19 - 3:25 p.m. | #
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Just to vent a little.. the TfL takeover means a significant hit for those of us seeing fast services replaced by all-stoppers. I was on the point of transitioning to commuting into London by train from a Maidenhead branch line, but this, and the limited bicycle parking facilities at Paddington, mean I will likely keep driving. Sighs..
JustinP | 04.12.19 - 5:06 p.m. | #
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Would have been nice if they had put a note in the corner of the map to explain the Zone2-1 "short hop" fare easement (in peak), with a list of stations where this applies (or a link to website). Not sure it applies to any other zones. Example is St. John's Wood to Baker Street is charged at £2.40 in peak, not £2.90
dg writes: Blogged. Entirely unmappable.
MilesT | 04.12.19 - 5:51 p.m. | #
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JustinP - there will still be a number of fast services for Maidenhead. For example, the half-hourly Didcot trains will run non-stop to M'head in the peak.
X-Plaistow | 04.12.19 - 5:58 p.m. | #
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The London Rail and Tube Map is so much better, and easily viewed on a smartphone. I've not seen any analysis of it though so it may have numerous errors I don't know about.
The Knowledge | 04.12.19 - 7:48 p.m. | #
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Justin, there is NO change in the stopping pattern with the TfL services. they are a direct replacement for the existing GWR stopping services, and the semi-fast and fast GWR trains are not affected.
Geofftech | 04.12.19 - 7:58 p.m. | #
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I travel Slough to Reading ( and return)most weekends.
I'm told my National Rail Disabled persons railcard discount can still be obtained if I travel on the T F L train.
Also will there be different fares for G W R and TFL Paddington-Reading and shorter journeys in between.
James | Homepage | 04.12.19 - 11:37 p.m. | #
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DG, when you say
"Also, don't get on a GWR train to Reading, Slough or wherever because TfL fares aren't valid on those."
this isn't accurate. Contactless fares to/from the Reading line are the same whoever operates the trains you get.
https://www.gwr.com/...contactless-payment
"To support TfL Rail’s payment option, we will also offer Contactless at all stations on the direct line between London Paddington and Reading. There will be no difference in fares between TfL Rail and GWR services."
dg writes: Updated, thanks. I thought I'd read somewhere that fast GWR services weren't included, but it seems they are. So that's good.
Larry Lard | 05.12.19 - 1:02 p.m. | #
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X-Plaistow/Geofftech Thanks for the corrections: I should perhaps have taken news on the local passenger association website and letters to the paper with a pinch of salt. As an off-peak traveller, I now see my mid evening service home is little changed. But my current morning connection into Paddington vanishes, replaced by a longer journey plus an extra change. If I go an hour later I am offered the choice of two extra changes for the fastest slower journey!
JustinP | 05.12.19 - 3:53 p.m. | #
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That's the problem with diagram maps.Dundonald Road tram stop looks as though its a fair way from Wimbledon.In reality,its a five minute walk.South Wimbledon station and Merton Park tram stop look miles away from Wimbledon,but in reality,are no more than a 10 minute walk.And then there is Queensway / Bayswater,which both should have purple interchange oyster pads,and a connector blob on the map it is easier to change between the central, and circle & district lines there,than at Notting Hill Gate.
Kevin Lucioni | 05.12.19 - 3:59 p.m. | #
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Blobs, daggers, dotted lines .... what an unholy visual mess this 'diagram' has become. It is, as already noted, so far removed from the clarity and simplicity of use for the purpose it is supposed to have - to tell you what order tube stations are in and where the lines interconnect. Fares information can and should be given in another format and the overlayering of other services should be on a well designed 'Connections' map. There really seems to be no real focus in TfL these on what passenger information actually is and it feels like in truth 'they'' don't know what it actually means or entails. Just a scramble to keep adding 'things' as they might be useful, doesn't matter if when you stand back you can't make head nor tails of what it is you've created.
Moquette | 12.12.19 - 7:18 a.m. | #
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