please empty your brain below
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Although the RER lines we travelled on were on the left. That confused me...
Ken | 12.03.13 - 6:22 a.m. | #
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Boris can talk about driverless trains but as he’s stated many times he’ll not be standing for re-election in 2016 he won’t be Mayor by the time they finally arrive. Line 1 took 4 years to convert from manned to fully-automated and is roughly the size of the Bakerloo Line which oddly is first on the list to go NoPO but as LUL’s Mike Brown has pointed out there is a £12bn funding gap that stops LUL planning any future work, particularly introducing new trains and signal systems on the Bakerloo and Piccadilly.
Not that driverless trains would reduce strike action, it would merely replace train drivers with less expensive “Train Attendants”, like the DLR’s Passenger Service Assistants (not Train Captains, that was dropped years ago). As with the DLR the Train Attendants wouldn’t be eligible to join ASLEF so they go to RMT as would the extra onctrol room staff needed to oversee operations. Less strikes? Really?
ASLEF shrugged | Homepage | 12.03.13 - 7:37 a.m. | #
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For fellow enthusiasts of Art Deco,
can I commend Mark Ovenden's excellent book - Paris Metro Style published by Capital Transport Transport Publishing (17 Nov 2008)English
ISBN-10: 1854143220
ISBN-13: 978-1854143228
I notice that copies are now being advertised on remaindered book sites so now is the time to pick up a bargain.
One of the key differences I note every time I travel on the Metro is that it smells distinctly different to the London Underground - can anyone explain why?
Mwmbwls | Homepage | 12.03.13 - 7:39 a.m. | #
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And as ever, the incomparable Carto Metro maps the Haxo story more clearly than words alone can manage - http://carto.metro.free.fr/cartes/metro-paris/index.php?gpslat=48.87813&gpslon=2.400441&zoom=3
marek | 12.03.13 - 7:50 a.m. | #
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3bis and 7bis were originally branches of lines 3 and 7, but were split off in order to provide a more frequent service on the main lines. (Mill Hill East's off peak service is similar) Line 14 may be the first completely new line form 65 years, but there have bene extensions to others, for example Line 1 to La Defense, or the middle section of Line 13 (the two ends were originally branches of Line 12, later split off like lines 3bis and 7bis and numbered 13 and 14, and then connected together)
Most French railways, including the RER, drive on the left. The Metro was deliberately designed by the Parisian municipality to be incompatible with the main lines - mainly to make it an unattractive prospect for the military to requisition it (the siege of Paris in the Franco-Prussian War was still only 30 years ago when the Metro was being planned). This is why the tunnels, and the trains, are much smaller than French main line trains. And being indepependant of the main lines, it could drive on what French consider the "right" side of the road - which would also make it easier to interwork with the tram system should that be desirable.
The most peculiar stationm must be Mirabeau on Line 10 - although both lines pass through the station tunnel, they are at different levels and only the eastbound has a platform. The arrangments in that area are complicated, as the ends of lines 9 and 10 have swapped over at different times.
timbo | 12.03.13 - 8:13 a.m. | #
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I have not yet traveled on Line 1 since it was converted to driver-less trains.
However I have traveled many times on Line 14 which has been driver-less since it opened. It also runs in deeper tunnels than most of the Paris Metro, and as far as I remember does not have or "train captain" or any Metro staff on board, but is really a driver-less and guard-less train. I would imagine that Line 1 is similar. So do we need a door opening member of staff on the DLR, and when the London underground goes driver-less why not make them guard-less too.
John | 12.03.13 - 9:17 a.m. | #
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You certainly chose the right day for your trip, DG. It's snowing in Paris at this very moment.
Great Aunt Annie | 12.03.13 - 9:47 a.m. | #
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I was going to mention the smell of the Paris Metro but notice that Mwmbwls has already commented on it above.
I can give a few possible reasons for the difference.
Some Lines use trains which have rubber tyres and these smell as they get hot.
The lines are not deep so rely less on forced air ventilation, and as the tunnels are not single bore the stations do not get forced air thrust in each time a train approaches. So maybe the air has more opportunity to stagnate.
Châtelet-Les-Halles is well known for its sulfurous odour, which seeps in from the ground. I think this is from the remains of rotting material as there was a market there once.
Maybe the Parisians are more highly scented than Londoners.
John | 12.03.13 - 9:47 a.m. | #
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An interesting post. Michael Portillo's programme (last night) also noted how many of the lines had been made by 'cut and cover,' a method which allowed the use of taller carriages than we typically have here.
I've looked up again where I stayed with best mate, and the nearest station was Anvers, with the result that most of our trips began or ended via Line 2. Now you explain it, it accounts for why it was that line that had the best views.
Hmmm. Maybe they're no more a talking point than the sight of pigeons over here; or maybe everyone else (dg included) is being too polite to mention them. Surely I can't be the only person to have seen the occasional mouse scurrying along the edge of a plaftorm?
RogerW | 12.03.13 - 10:51 a.m. | #
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Mice in Paris? You get those relatively frequently in London, although usually under the tracks not on the platform.
Andrew | 12.03.13 - 11:54 a.m. | #
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presumably the Paris Metro has no ban on photography? and I've seen many mice on tracks in Central London stations, also sometimes on platforms if there are few humans around
amber | 12.03.13 - 11:58 a.m. | #
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@ Amber - no ban that I am aware of but you do get some very odd looks from the train drivers. As in London many platforms are quite gloomy so getting shots of trains is difficult - more so on Line 1 now it has platform doors as a result of full automation. There is an open air gap at Bastille where a photo of Line 1 taken from the street is possible. It is a fascinating system though!
PC | 12.03.13 - 12:36 p.m. | #
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Yes - you do get some odd looks for taking photos, which I found when I was over there a few years ago.
I enjoyed Cite station as well - the lamps are great http://adwright.co.uk/2007/05/01/le-metro/
Adam | Homepage | 12.03.13 - 1:19 p.m. | #
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Lucky you weren't in Paris today!
NLW | 12.03.13 - 5:24 p.m. | #
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John: The issue is not with opening the doors or otherwise - there are several systems that run completely driverless around the world. The issue is that there is no escape mechanism.
Modern driverless lines have a tunnel with a walkway down the side and safety exits/refuges every x metres. Doing that on the underground would be ridiculously prohibitive, although I IIRC the Jubilee Line extension was built with this in mind.
Kirk | 12.03.13 - 7:06 p.m. | #
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...and did you buy your Metro ticket on the Eurostar as postulated in your 'on the way' blog yesterday ? and if so, was it cheaper than waiting to buy it at a Metro station ?
JohnHB | 12.03.13 - 8:13 p.m. | #
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The RER also has its own special smell (that of the sewers).The RER is really efficient for getting from East to West in a few minutes and some of the trains are double decker.However if you ever work in Paris, rush hours can be as crowded as in London and lines do break down as they do in London. If your office is in the suburbs trains can get really crowded as well as more people use public transport to get to their suburban office than in Greater London. But you get a lovely French working lunch!
kissenme | 12.03.13 - 8:26 p.m. | #
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There's a nice comedy sketch on Youtube with some of those metro lines you mentioned personified: Line 1 (the leader and everybody's helpful friend), the speedy Line 14, the stylish Line 4 and the evil, dirty RER Line B who makes everyone late for work and angry (trust me I know!): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OT8yyeXAzi8
Also, did you not visit Châtelet-Les Halles? The largest underground station in the world and definitely not so easy to navigate, or even to find the way out!
James | 12.03.13 - 10:01 p.m. | #
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Further to kissenme, yes the RER is often delayed and crowded, though it is at least less expensive than the the tube for an equivalent travel pass. Furthermore, employers are required to subsidise 50% of the pass cost. Oh, and there's a new scheme that lets you travel anywhere on the Ile-de-France network during the weekend, even if you only have a 'Carte Navigo' for the central zone.
James | 12.03.13 - 10:10 p.m. | #
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Paris has also managed to build a fair few tramlines from scratch too with plenty more planned. Meanwhile back in London...
R | 12.03.13 - 11:38 p.m. | #
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Response to Kirk. As the DLR runs mostly above ground there is no problem with escape. Yet they still have a train attendant. Maybe they need to fit platform doors.
John | 13.03.13 - 7:53 a.m. | #
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Thirty years ago the metro used to smell strongly of asbestos, from the brakes, and the gaps between the lines in stations were covered in white dust. Almost certainly very dangerous, but I miss the smell.
Alan Burkitt-Gray | 13.03.13 - 11:01 a.m. | #
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3bis; Paris's very own Hainault-Woodford...
David | 13.03.13 - 2:41 p.m. | #
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Aw, I was expecing a "Regarder le trou" on your AudioBoo!
martxw | 13.03.13 - 4:10 p.m. | #
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The London Underground and the Paris metro have one station name in common - Temple. (I lost a point in a pub quiz by not distinguishing between St Paul and St Paul's) but looking at that Wiki piece on closed metro stations I notice that from 1932 to 1939 they both had an 'Arsenal' station.
John Rimmer | 16.03.13 - 12:25 p.m. | #
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If you're ever in Berlin, there are a few short lines on the U Bahn there as well (1.5km 3 station U55 and 2.8km 5 station U4)
Hans Versluys | Homepage | 18.03.13 - 11:20 p.m. | #
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John - Re the DLR - I believe the attendants are largely there for passenger perception reasons - in this country there isn't a concept of driverless trains, whereas in other countries they're used to it, with or usually without PEDs.
Probably the main issue is the track current - track trespass could adequately be monitored by automated CCTV.
Kirk | 29.03.13 - 10:25 a.m. | #
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Plus I'm sure you all know that PEDs couldn't be used without automated trains, as the stopping tolerance is ridiculously small.
Kirk | 29.03.13 - 10:28 a.m. | #
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