please empty your brain below
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Fascinating stuff. One of my bugbears is the general lack of information available, both about OSI's and about how the interchanges within stations vary. I know there are apps that include all this but I still feel that TFL could be doing more. It's not easy to find out when there is a cross-platform interchange or when you have to walk down one of their many murderously long tunnels. The same is true for the National Rail interchanges, some of which are relatively straightforward and others are less so and you are only likely to find this out once you are, for example, trapped in the hell that is the Elephant and Castle shopping centre.
Whiff | 12.11.12 - 5:03 a.m. | #
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At Bank/Monument, staff who need to mpve from one to the other will walk above ground, and if asked for directions will advise this to fit-looking passengers.
amber | 12.11.12 - 6:21 a.m. | #
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OSI = Out of Station Interchange.
Lots more about OSIs here, from Tube Week last year. And a full list here.
diamond geezer | Homepage | 12.11.12 - 6:45 a.m. | #
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Wow, you actually timed it all with a stopwatch? That is a most impressive display of geekery. Fabulous, and very useful, although I would've included the walk from Farringdon to Chancery Lane.
Karen | Homepage | 12.11.12 - 7:48 a.m. | #
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A couple of my favourite OSIs in zone 1, both involving the Central line:
- Farringdon to Chancery Lane.
Down Cowcross Street, across Farringdon Road to go over the Fleet, up Greville Street past Bleeding Heart Yard, over Hatton Garden and left into Leather Lane past a pub that always reminds me of this blog. Then a right to cut through the precincts of Holborn Bar noting the rather striking war memorial for the Prudential before emerging onto Holborn with the roundels for Chancery Lane close at hand.
- Mansion House to Bank (Central line)
Out of the subway signed for the Magistrates Court at Mansion House (I think it is exit three), brisk walk down Queen Victoria Street going past a building site and the former temporary home of the Temple of Mithras on the right and No 1 Poultry on the left: a building gaining the macabre reputation it’s architecture so richly deserves. Over Walbrook and sneak down the second entrance into Bank station just past the Mansion House. This is the ‘secret’ entrance to Bank station. Lack of a Underground bullseye means It isn’t at all obvious and signs at the bottom of the stairs urge hush. The unspoken reason? So as to not disturb the next door neighbour when he is trying to sleep.
Marc | 12.11.12 - 8:29 a.m. | #
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North Ealing to West Acton is NOT an official OSI, but can be walked in 4 minutes - less time than some of the official interchanges here.
if you're heading into central London (say, Holborn), coming south down the Piccadilly, it's quicker to make this change and speed into town on a Central Line train rather than stay on the Piccadilly. Only if you've got a travelcard though, i guess ...
geofftech | Homepage | 12.11.12 - 8:47 a.m. | #
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Warren Street/ Euston Square is an important omission from the OSI list in my book. Under the five mins for the walk along Euston Road past UCH.
Also Regents Park/ Gt Portland St. which is even quicker.
Chancery Lane to Farringdon is even signposted along the way !
Paul | 12.11.12 - 8:56 a.m. | #
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Ah yes, Paddington to Lancaster Gate, very good, used to use this to catch mainline trains from Paddington when we lived near Holborn.
I think this one should be more widely publicised, what with the high tedium of the Circle/ H&C.
Lorenzo | 12.11.12 - 9:25 a.m. | #
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Chancery Lane to Farringdon is even signposted along the way !
But not for the purposes of interchange. It was done because Farringdon used to be often closed at weekends due to engineering work and may be in the future too.
Pedantic of Purley | 12.11.12 - 9:42 a.m. | #
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What is possible and what is sensible are two different things. Yes, Bayswater to Queensway is possible but makes no sense when you can change at Notting Hill Gate. And why would anyone change between the two Paddingtons when they can do so easily at Edgware Road? So why signpost it ?
I sometimes wonder why more is not made using Lancaster Gate for Paddington e.g. better signage along the street. I have always assumed that a factor may be the limited capacity due to the lifts (there are lifts there aren't there ?) .
Pedantic of Purley | 12.11.12 - 9:47 a.m. | #
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Taking the rare chance to out-pedantic Pedantic of Purley, coming south on the Bakerloo and heading for Shepherds Bush or Hammersmith is about the only time you would probably change between the two Paddingtons.
Whiff | 12.11.12 - 9:55 a.m. | #
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Isn't Euston Square to Warren Street just as quick a walk as Euston Square to Euston?
Audrey | 12.11.12 - 10:59 a.m. | #
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"Hammersmith ? Hammersmith (1m30) This non-trivial interchange requires walking through a shopping centre and crossing two main roads."
I presume this is only possible if the shopping centre is open. What about if you are outside those times?
Jon Combe | 12.11.12 - 12:43 p.m. | #
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Strangely, Bank to Cannon Street on surface is considerably quicker than Bank to Monument on surface or underground.
Martin Potts | 12.11.12 - 12:53 p.m. | #
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i suspect LU don't publicise Lancaster Gates's proximity to Paddington more is because it is a lift-only station, no escalators. You'd get people catching the Heathrow Express out of padddington, lugging all their bags out of Lancaster Gate station. very handy though if you're not laden down with luggage.
geofftech | Homepage | 12.11.12 - 1:24 p.m. | #
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the shopping centre is always 'open' (even if the shops are closed) to allow access to both entrances to Hammersmith station - and of course the bus station which is an integral part of the structure.
many years year ago, before they build the bus station there used to be a SUBWAY (oh yes!) between the two, long since gone and blocked up, but i bet some of it somewhere still remains ...
geofftech | Homepage | 12.11.12 - 1:26 p.m. | #
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The side entrance to Fenchurch Street is by no means new, it's been there at least 20 years!
Meg | 12.11.12 - 3:49 p.m. | #
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Well geofftech I have been using the tube stations at Hammersmith since the 1950's and cannot recall them being joined by a subway. I often wish they were when I have had to change lines there, and wondered why they did not build an under-street connection when the Piccadilly/District line station was rebuilt. Does anyone know for certain they were connected once and if so why was the connection closed?
John | 12.11.12 - 3:59 p.m. | #
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I can remember the subway at Hammersmith, complete with dragon mural. Dingy and horrible place it was too. I assume it was removed when the new bus station was being built about twenty years ago, but it's even longer than that since I was a regular user of either Hammersmith station.
Regents Park/Great Portland Street are a stone's throw from each other. St Pauls and Barbican are also very close together. Perhaps he biggest lost opportunity is Aldwych and Temple.
The longest interchange I know of without going hrough a barrier line is probably between the W&C and Circle lines at Bank/Monument
timbo | 12.11.12 - 4:20 p.m. | #
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@ John - oh there was definitely a subway under the Hammersmith gyratory that linked the D&P and H&C stations. I've trudged through it plenty of times trying to avoid the hordes coming the other way plus the buskers and beggars. I think it persisted even after the D&P site was modernised. I think there was a later decision to try to brighten up the gyratory and improve pedestrian flows that created the current pedestrian crossing and saw the subway disappear from use. I suspect part of it still lurks under the road.
PC | 12.11.12 - 4:34 p.m. | #
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Here's a picture - late 70s/early 80s I would guess from the vehicles - showing the southern entrance to the subway immediately outside the Dis/Pic main entrance
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7004/6647609751_43d65dc2b2_z.jpg
timbo | 12.11.12 - 4:34 p.m. | #
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the evidence of the subway on the Dis/Pic side is long gone, but i'm sure only a few years back you could still still on the H&C side where the subway steps had been filled in.
i'm sure the effort of filling in the entire subway didn't happen - just the entrances, meaning yes .. cars every day are still driving over a disused pedestrain subway, clogged up with damp and god knows what else nowadays! i wonder if there is still access into it via a manhole? as it's the sort of place that Cable companies love to use to run their infrastructure. Love the old 1970's photo!
geofftech | Homepage | 12.11.12 - 4:54 p.m. | #
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I agree with your comments about the lack of signposting at Paddington, but I think it is ridiculous to show the connections from the H&C on tube maps at all as it is such a long distance.
This weekend was particularly bad as, although trains were running on the H&C, they were not stopping at Paddington. I heard no announcements in the main line station or on the mainline trains I arrived on.
Many people were doing a lot of walking.
Martin | 12.11.12 - 5:59 p.m. | #
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Ah yes, Thanks. The photo brings it back. I think I had forgotten it as you had to exit the station to use it, so it would probably have been a council maintained subway to cross the road, London councils seem to like closing pedestrian subways, there are many lost ones in London. I think that one at Hammersmith had a few other entrances and exits, one being outside the old Broadway cinema.
What I had been thinking of was a London Transport subway from the tube stations direct, without exiting to the street first then having to use a road crossing council subway. What LT could have done was maybe buy the old subway from the council, close the pavement public access's and extend the subway into the District/Picadilly platform levels. On the H&C side which has platforms at street level it could have been extended into the booking hall and then have stairs.
Now I suppose like many others it stands empty.
John | 12.11.12 - 6:12 p.m. | #
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Which reminds me, I think that the original plans for Shepherds Bush tube station when it was rebuilt and the new overground station opened next door, included a subway to link the two, but funds would not cover the cost. Both stations have platform below street level.
I like dg's tube week.
John | 12.11.12 - 6:18 p.m. | #
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I've never understood why we have to have a limited list of OSI's. Why, for example is it ok to walk between Park Royal and Hanger Lane but not between North Ealing and West Acton. Is there a reason why ANY gap of 10 minutes between different stations that shows up on an Oyster Card record can't be allowed as a free interchange.
Whiff | 13.11.12 - 12:27 a.m. | #
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I've used the Northwick Park to Kenton link a couple of times to get to Wembley from beyond Harrow & Wealdstone. Very easy to do.
Dave | 13.11.12 - 4:36 a.m. | #
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The tube map will be getting another one soon when the South London Line branch of the overground opens in December - as I'm guessing Clapham North & Clapham High Street will be shown as connecting as they are so close
Geoff | 13.11.12 - 9:31 p.m. | #
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One I'm surprised isn't on DG's list is Aldgate to Tower Gateway. This takes me less than 5 minutes to walk, and is quicker to/from the northern side of the circle than going round to Tower Hill and gives you direct access to the Met as well.
How long is the Southwark to Waterloo East interchange?
Chris M | 14.11.12 - 2:03 p.m. | #
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