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General comments about Next Train Indicators (and Next Bus Indicators) have been moved here: comments (12)

diamond geezer | Homepage | 26.04.18 - 7:11 a.m. | #

Fantastic research.

Regards

zin92 | 26.04.18 - 7:17 a.m. | #

The indicator at Hackney Downs at the entrance to the walkway going to Central is particularly egregious - it seems to take trains off about 10min before they arrive at Central, despite the walk taking about 3 minutes.

dg writes: Agreed. Egregious in both directions.

WAGN | 26.04.18 - 7:22 a.m. | #

Brilliant research - confirming what I have suspected for many years.

Countdown displays at bus stops used to also be incapable of displaying "1 min" and do the jump from 2 to nothing. I always assumed this was a technical limitation though.

BP | 26.04.18 - 7:57 a.m. | #

The inconsistencies highlighted are inexplicable to me, but the remainder suggests that TfL have devoted significant budget to consultants specialising in behavioural and cognitive sciences.

Frank F | 26.04.18 - 8:00 a.m. | #

was at White City just yesterday heading for Ealing.

at the entrance, the next two trains shown were a West Ruislip in 4 mins, and an Ealing Broadway in 8 mins.

"no need to rush" i thought, as i took a slow walk down to the platform...

...and caught the previous Ealing Broadway train that was there, still sitting there, and in fact sat there for a whole 60 seconds once i'd got on before it departed.

*sigh*

Geofftech | 26.04.18 - 8:19 a.m. | #

Dear DG

Please don't explain the psychological conditioning to the lab rats - it messes up the experiment.

Jane | 26.04.18 - 8:52 a.m. | #

One problem is that the 'Next Train' indicator is really used in two ways. One is the obvious one. The other is to assess how well the service is running before committing to going to the platforms. In the latter case you don't really mind not catching the first train - you just want to know you won't have to wait long.

My horror example is platforms 8/9 at London Bridge in the evening. You are at the bottom of the long escalator. Next train is 3 minutes away, supposedly. But, because of the large dwell time there, you can be fairly sure of catching an earlier train without effort - sometimes even when the train was in the platform when you were at the bottom of the escalators.

Pedantic of Purley | 26.04.18 - 9:23 a.m. | #

What an extraordinary thing to do. I don't like the phrase 'nanny state' but it seems awfully like that. It is not dissimilar to the way you or someone wrote about how people are manipulated by station signage, except perhaps that is understandable for practical and safety reasons.

Andrew | Homepage | 26.04.18 - 9:33 a.m. | #

I do wish the powers that be would trust me to make my own decision whether or not to run for the train.

Sadly, some in our society appear to be unable to accept responsibility for their own actions (I'm talking about the 'compensation' brigade), so we all get treated like children.

R.O. Beethoven | 26.04.18 - 10:11 a.m. | #

I'd noticed that at South Ruislip on the infrequent times I'd used it.
Traveled from there last weekend and the ticket hall display said 7 minutes.
Told DH to get a move on as there's probably one arriving sooner and so there was - about 2 minutes away!

Also, "TfL minutes" are a standing joke in our family.

Cornish Cockney | 26.04.18 - 11:03 a.m. | #

Another White City oddity is that eastbound trains on platform 4 are often shown as being 2 minutes away by the on-platform indicator when they're actually pulling in to the station. Thus turning up when it says there's a 4 minute wait for the next train actually means it's likely only to be 2.

Moogal | 26.04.18 - 12:21 p.m. | #

Presumably the next train indicators attempt to show the departure time, not the arrival time? In which case it might be reasonable to add 20 seconds to the walk time to allow time for the doors to close?

I suspect that, rather than safety, the thing that's driving this is the desire to get trains away promptly.

Ian Brooker | 26.04.18 - 12:52 p.m. | #

I've also noticed something like this at a couple of places. Morden is one.

Of course, unlike DG I don't have the tenacity to then do such thorough research.

I have to say that I side with TfL though. It's clearly designed to stop people rushing to catch a train and the benefit in stopping people pushing, shoving and then delaying the train seems a sensible balance.

Also worth pointing out that a lot of people walk much slower than a fit and healthy adult on his own.

Eric | 26.04.18 - 1:41 p.m. | #

Whatever TfL's reason at Pudding Mill Lane - a tumbleweed DLR backwater - it isn't "stopping people pushing, shoving and then delaying the train".

diamond geezer | Homepage | 26.04.18 - 2:14 p.m. | #

"At Bow Road the Next Train Indicator tells the truth..."

Judging by your previous postings I'm assured that this is some sort of miracle.

Greg | 26.04.18 - 4:02 p.m. | #

At Hillingdon station there is somewhat of the reverse in that the train that has previously departed seems to linger around for a time (sometimes over 60 seconds), this delay happens both on the platform and ticket hall Next Train Indicators.

Golden Arrow | 26.04.18 - 4:12 p.m. | #

I'll definitely be checking this next time im out. I'll especially like to see what happens at a tube terminus with a ticket hall display, I know numerous times I've seen "1min" displayed for what felt like forever or at least long enough for last minute runners to fill the nearest carriage to the stairs.

Ethan | 26.04.18 - 6:20 p.m. | #

I've also noticed at the new London Bridge station that the displays on the concourse and those on the platform don't always match. If a train is less than 1 or 2 minutes away, it shows the following train, which is going to a completely different destination and is described as the "next train". Travel up the escalator and the first train is only just pulling in to the platform. I'm sure people who don't look at the indicators on the platform (which are correct) get the wrong train sometimes.

Adrian | 26.04.18 - 9:01 p.m. | #

I come to believe this to be a gross problem on TfL's part. Even if the contracts are awarded to different companies according to geographical distribution, at least I expect the requirements be consistent.

Patrickov | 27.04.18 - 6:06 a.m. | #

But is this the minutes till a train’s arrival - or its departure? There is a difference after all!

Rob Healy | Homepage | 27.04.18 - 7:09 a.m. | #

Passengers attempting to board at last minute appears to me to be a problem increasing with time. With the DLR with some of the best punctuality in the world (there are a few days each year with 100.0% punctuality to the minute I believe), then controlling passenger behaviour becomes as important as vehicle performance. I would suspect that this is more performance related than safety related.

At Stratford International DLR they've been doing this for a while now. It's fairly easy to tell when a train is imminently departing if it says 10 minutes and 20 minutes, implying that the '0 minute' train is actually still present.

Jamie | 27.04.18 - 9:01 a.m. | #

The DLR indicators only changed in the last few months. Previously at my home station I knew if the opposite platform NTI said 2 min I would make the train; now it's 50/50. At Cutty Sark in rush hour I've learned that if the first train is 4 min or longer on the monitor at the entrance it's worth walking down the escalators as there's probably one in 1-2min as well. To start with I thought the service was disrupted!

SEdith | 27.04.18 - 12:29 p.m. | #

At Stanmore the indicator visible over the gate line seems to match what is on the platforms including going from "1 min" to "Ready". It's about 50 m to the trains on 1 & 2 but twice as far to a train in 3.

MikeR | 27.04.18 - 1:43 p.m. | #











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