please empty your brain below
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I vote for DEAL, NO DEAL and REMAIN
John | 13.12.18 - 7:18 a.m. | #
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A preferential vote is the solution.
Mark the options 1,2,3 as you choose (marking fewer is allowed). The 1st preferences are counted and subsequent ones transferred at lesser values, until the threshold is passed by the most popular. Nerdier folk than me can be more specific.
The "people" end up with their preferred option or the least worst one.
RosemaryT | 13.12.18 - 7:21 a.m. | #
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Are you saying that people who voted leave are too thick to understand single transferable voting? You're probably right
ian | 13.12.18 - 7:24 a.m. | #
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Leave with no deal and then have a referendum in 6 months to see if we want to rejoin straightaway on same terms. Maybe TM could negotiate that with EU.
Running_Correspondent | 13.12.18 - 7:29 a.m. | #
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Single transferable vote will be resisted by parliament as - for some reason - they are all scared of it.
But another option would be a two stage vote for do you accept the deal.
If rejected, present a "now what?" No deal or remain.
Although they're are other ways you could cut it up.
One thing is for sure. If this route gets explored by Parliament, expect even more arguments.
Andrew Bowden | Homepage | 13.12.18 - 8:05 a.m. | #
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On a pure level, the vote was to leave, not someones interpretation of leave, just go, walk out the door, don't turn around, we're not welcome anymore.
This car crash will continue after the Christmas break.
Still Anon | 13.12.18 - 8:32 a.m. | #
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On a pure level, the vote was to leave, not someone’s interpretation of leave. Just leave the EU, stay in the single market, the customs union, the EEA.
Graham | 13.12.18 - 8:40 a.m. | #
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The global plan is for a United states of Europe. UK will not be allowed to leave the EU, no matter what the people think. Am amazed the vote wasn't properly fixed in the first place, like the Scottish Independence vote
Marty | 13.12.18 - 8:46 a.m. | #
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As Andrew Bowden says, you need two questions. (1) Would you prefer to leave or remain? (2) And if we leave, would you prefer this deal or no deal?
But it is still a blunt instrument, and doesn't capture a preference for a different deal outcome, even if one were theoretically available.
What a mess.
Andrew | 13.12.18 - 9:08 a.m. | #
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I vote allowed (in) on even days, and excluded (out) on odd days.
Sundays excluded.
scrumpy | 13.12.18 - 9:14 a.m. | #
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The referendum over the Brexit really spotlighted the Dunning & Kruger effect.
The people of the UK mainly the English have NEVER been comfortable in the EU for 40 years.
Leaving the EU is an article of faith for many, economic facts are ignored.
The Irony is in 2019 with the new EU elections, the EU is going to morph into a EU which the UK could live with, but of course the UK will be out by then.
YDU | 13.12.18 - 9:16 a.m. | #
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We're doomed.
Bloody mess.
Cornish Cockney | 13.12.18 - 9:25 a.m. | #
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I suspect DG knows "Arrow's Impossibility Theorem", for others it's an interesting thing to know.
Peter | 13.12.18 - 9:25 a.m. | #
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Jeremy Vine recently reported the interpretation that to address the issue that some people want a sweet dish and some want savoury, May has come up with a compromise of bacon trifle.
Malcolm | 13.12.18 - 9:46 a.m. | #
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To me an interesting question is whether the ardent Leavers are democrats. I understand that their view is:
a) 52% of the voters in the referendum supported Leave 2+ years ago, so we must leave; and
b) 63% of Conservative MPs had confidence in the PM yesterday, so she must resign.
Ian | 13.12.18 - 9:54 a.m. | #
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It's nonsense. Parliament would never approve No Deal, even if people chose it in a referendum. There's only a small group of MPs who would happily demolish the economy for doctrinal reasons. It's whatever fudge May comes back with or Remain.
Chz | 13.12.18 - 10:15 a.m. | #
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The referendum was lost, goodbye EU
Sir Biton | 13.12.18 - 10:17 a.m. | #
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Radical solution needed. Working on it.
Nigel Downing | Homepage | 13.12.18 - 10:18 a.m. | #
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Andrew 0908/Andrew Bowden 0805
But that's the problem - if there are equal numbers favouring deal, no deal, and remain, AB's questions result in either no deal or remain, depending on the 2nd choices of those who would have preferred the deal. The other Andrew would have ended up either with deal or no deal, depending on the 2nd preferences of the remainers. Unless all three options are offered on an equal footing, the one which gets a "bye" to the second round has an advantage over the others.
timbo again | 13.12.18 - 10:45 a.m. | #
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@Nigel Downing
Invite the other 27 nations to join the United Kingdom.
timbo again again | 13.12.18 - 10:47 a.m. | #
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Is that real polling you're referring to DG? I'm surprised if 'no deal' beats remain on that basis, because surely some moderate or former leavers would rather remain than fall (leap) off the cliff.... wouldn't they? Conversely, on the last dichotomy, would ardent leavers really choose remain over any form of leaving? The three dichotomies with their three different outcomes all look a bit too neat...
Sarah | Homepage | 13.12.18 - 11:27 a.m. | #
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Bacon trifle - isn't that on the menu at the Fat Duck?
Strabismus | 13.12.18 - 11:51 a.m. | #
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If you choose Remain, there is then the question of whether the EU let us forget the whole fiasco and we go back to the way we were. What are the chances that the EU will say that we can remain, but because of how we have messed them about, we need to accept some changes, such as Schengen, the Euro, reduced influence within the EU and so forth. So Remain could also end up with Deal or No Deal options as well.
Jimbo | 13.12.18 - 12:47 p.m. | #
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@Jimbo
Yes, the EU has to allow us to stay on exactly the same terms, becuase it has been determined that we can unilaterally revoke Article 50.
Will | 13.12.18 - 1:22 p.m. | #
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Indeed, if we remain by revoking Article 50, then things are "as you were". On the other hand, if we set off on the transition period in the deal, and then decide we want back in, we may have to accept some changes.
I'd love to be in the Euro though. What's not to like? My savings and earnings are now worth only 80% of what they were, being denominated in falling pounds.
Malcolm | 13.12.18 - 5:03 p.m. | #
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@ Malcolm
Depends when you start counting: in its first year the euro fell 10% against the pound, from 70p to 63p. An even faster drop was in 2015, when it dropped from 78p to 71p in the first six months
timbo again again again | Homepage | 13.12.18 - 6:06 p.m. | #
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"we" were not fully committed to the idea of the EU to start with as never adopted the Euro currency. and being an island "we" also gave ourselves the option of not having an open border.
E | 13.12.18 - 6:42 p.m. | #
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Yeah, it's a good thing we're an island. If we happened to have a land border with another EU country this whole Brexit thing would get complicated, perhaps impossible.
Graham | 13.12.18 - 10:21 p.m. | #
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Happy to see the interminable Brexit debate fading to unintelligible grey.
Next....
NickW | 13.12.18 - 10:44 p.m. | #
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In the last 36 hours I have read respectable journalists say that the confidence vote makes no-deal more likely and that it makes no-deal almost certain not to happen!
whiff | 13.12.18 - 10:44 p.m. | #
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@Sarah,
I think that this is the source data for the poll that DG refers to.
This poll asked responders to rank the May deal, No deal and Remain as first, second and third favourite.
And here's how this was interpreted to predict how people would vote if they were only presented with two choices, ie May deal/No deal, May deal/Remain and No deal/Remain.
Regards
zin92 | 14.12.18 - 6:42 a.m. | #
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I hadn't come across the bacon trifle analogy until now. I rather like it (the analogy, not the actual dish).
Jonathan Wadman | 14.12.18 - 12:14 p.m. | #
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...is it my screen, or does the DG "grey-effect" get slightly dimmer further on down?
Grumpy Anon | 14.12.18 - 12:22 p.m. | #
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We voted against Remain - it shouldn't even be mentioned anymore...
Darren | 14.12.18 - 9:16 p.m. | #
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We voted against the Alternate vote, so obviously it can't even be mentioned as a possible decision method here.
Mike D | 14.12.18 - 10:49 p.m. | #
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What really grinds my goat is people who say "Bregg-zit" - Tony Blair was at it on the radio this morning. At least it doesn't divide the population down the middle - it's more like a 85/15% split, I'd say.
NickW | 14.12.18 - 11:10 p.m. | #
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