please empty your brain below

I change at Westminster every day and the indicator board there shows the next 4 trains rather than 3, provided there actually are 4 trains west of Mansion House.

dg writes: Thanks. I've updated the 3 to a 4 (and assumed that King's Cross is the same.

Note that the max time shown will vary by direction because it depends how far the station is from either the change in signalling system or a point where lines merge or trains start, so there could be more notice in one direction than another.

There are smartphone apps which give next train arrival info for up to 30 minutes, although this isn't much use if you are already below ground and don't have a signal, and the data is subject to change as trains join the line.

Things to do when its bucketing down outside...

Blimey DG, is it healthy to spend such a long time in a semi-subterranean place? You must have been there all day!

DG, you must have the patience of a Saint!

- One does have to wonder how I can get the information up on an App on my phone, but LU can't have an indicator on the platform.

- At South Ken, on the District/Circle platforms, there is a Windows PC running Internet Explorer with the times of ALL the trains for .. ooh, at least 20 minutes. I know this because yesterday I waited 23 minutes for a Circle Line train (having JUST missed one), and watched it come all the way round from King's Cross.. Tower Hill... and yup, it arrived 23 minutes later. So they are capable of knowing and telling you all this information

- I've quite often taken to the habit (when i'm not in a hurry) recently of timing how long it REALLY is when the board flashes to '1 Min' for the next train. I take that to mean the moment the train has stopped in the platform with the doors open. The Central Line trains 1 Min usually means about 1 min, 40 secs, whilst the Piccadilly Line is consistently the worst, where 1 min really averages out at about 2 minutes. I've got them all typed up in a spreadsheet ...

The stretch of the Piccadilly line from Heathrow to Hammersmith (and beyond) cannot/does not display train times at all. What a way to welcome visitors to our public transportation system.

On most of the Circle Line you get a decent mobile signal. Use an App on your phone or the Tfl website - get better info too than most of the indicators.

@Geofftech have you done the DLR too? When I used to travel on the DLR the times indicated used to bear no relation to actual times - hence I dubbed wildly inaccurate waiting times "DLR time".

I've had to use South Kensington a lot recently eastbound, and you only get the one minute warning (or less) of the next train in this direction.

Therefore, for completeness, recommend that you do this trip in the opposite direction as well (just kidding).

Savvy travellers at Tower Hill look to the right, to see if the indicator's changing!

And then there is the Met line - lots of exciting departure boards, all electronic... which have been completely blank for the past two years...

Noticed the new Countdown indicators added to Bow Road bus stops a few days' ago? Nothing to do with the Ilympics, surely?

I have not done the DLR. It's on my list though! becuase it's more modern and the equipment is newer, i have more faith in what they tell me though. would be interesting to know.

what gets me is that if they had 'next train' information for the next 4 or 5 trains at every station, then they could DO AWAY with the ridiculous 'Good Service' boards and indicators, because you could see at a glance when your next train really was, and thus how good the service really is running, and not just the lie they tell you from the Network Operations Centre based on overall performance of that line. (e.g my 23 minute wait for a Circle Line train yesterday - you gussed it, 'Good Service' was being shown...)

I actually find the ones at Liverpool street not always very informative - I arrive in the mornings and sometimes all the sign tells you is which lines run from that platform (this is Westbound). Whitechapel also is quite annoying, merely telling you which destination the train has, no clue as to how long it will be - and before they opened the overground they used to give you the wrong information. The sign would say the next Hammersmith train would arrive at platform X, and then you would watch as the train pulled into the farthest platform from you and pulled away before you got there.

What you do get between Hammersmith and Paddington is the odd announcement telling you when the next train is leaving a station down the line. The voice then goes on to tell you how many minutes you'll have to wait for it to get to your station and every station before and after.

e.g.
The next train will be leaving Hammersmith now.
It will arrive at Latimer Road in 4 minutes, Shepherds Bush Market 10 minutes (and so on)

PS I made that example up.

Andrew, I expect that is because that same announcement is being made to all the stations on the line at the same time from the control centre.

Isn't it about time you bought some new trousers? Be interested to see if you need a bigger or smaller size. This Tube stuff gets a bit tedious for us living out in the sticks. (Sorry Geoff)

I bought some new trousers earlier this year.
Same size.
Gobsmackingly appalling customer service.
But I'd rather not publish my rant online, thanks, in case they sued me.
In the meantime, Next Train Indicators.

At Farringdon eastbound, new CCTV gantries obscured the next train indicators from most of the staircase and east end of the platform. i have noticed the new ones going in and hope they are better placed to be - er - actually visible. Or we'll have another Mile End scenario!


Has DG given us enough information to work out the minimum time this exercise took?

My local, Hornsey (First Capital Connect), regularly shows the next train time, alternating with 'On time', while the actual time at the bottom of the screen is one or two minutes later. Huh?

From time to time my local FCC station Palmers Green shows the train On Time (alternating with the scheduled time), then it switches to something like 2 minutes late, then switches back to On Time again. Guess it must be something to do with how / where the trains are logged further North.

I must say though how reliable my service is (Hertford North branch to Moorgate). I use Chilterns Railways' real time App and very rarely is anything on my line when I travel more than a coup,e of minutes late when I check at home.

There's inconsistencies between platforms at some stations too, for example Northbound at High St Ken is the 50 year old lightbox, whereas Southbound has a proper next train indicator, showing at least 2 trains, maybe 3?

Edgware Road westbound is hopeless, you come off a westbound Hammersmith train wanting to continue down the Circle/District, and have no idea from which platform the next train will go from, and whether you need to run over the stairs or not...

The tube indicators timing isn't accurate. A minute is not a minute, or what I understand to be a minute. It varies all the time on the Picadilly Line. For example last week a minute varied between 1 minute 32 seconds and 45 seconds (and there is nothing wrong with my watch).

Also the Useless Cretin Committee put up "exit" and "information" signs infront of the indicators some time ago so when one stands at the end of platform the indicator can't been seen.

PS Could we not have the redacted trouser rant?
@Mikey C

That seems to be sensible - southbound at HSK you need to know where the next two or three trains are going, firstly to know whether its next station is Gloucester Road or Earls Court, and secondly to allow you to decide whether, if the first train isn't going where you want, wheter it's worth waiting, or better to take the first train and changing.

Northbound all rains go to Edgware Road - even before he Circle was trancated your best bet was always to take the first train. (nd because of the junction just upstream, the system never knows what order the trains will arrive anyway!

Compare that with the "one size fits all" approach of SWT, which put expensive "next three trains" indcators on the London-bound platforms at all their suburban stations - even Vauxhall! - despite the fact that all trains call at all stations to Waterloo.

On a slight variation of the theme of LU train departures I note that the station timetable pdfs from the TfL journey planner now show each departure individually. DG can now see exactly what time a District or H&C train is due to leave Bow Road.

I seem to recall a minirant about changes to DLR timetable posters but now you can the precise timetabled time for every LU departure.

I am not sure why people are quite so mystified about the variation in DMI information. It's almost all driven off signalling sections and these all vary in length across the network. Only newly upgraded lines give pretty accurate info because the train location info is held centrally. Trackernet is the system that LU use to provide the web and app based info. It ties together signalling data across the lines and also from the various sections of each line where the old control room systems can't do this.

Stephen, we arrived at Hornsey this morning at, say 08:21. Next train indicators in the ticket hall (shed) said the next train was cancelled and the one after was 23 minutes late. To me that is just too late to have any meaning, so we walked to Turnpike Lane so as not to find a train so packed with people from Hertford North that we'd not fit on anyway ;-)

Timbo
I understand that northbound at High St Ken the destination doesn't really matter, but the length of time to wait does matter, as sometimes the gaps can be quite bad, and it's sometimes quicker to divert to the circle going the other way.

Incidentally, the southbound indicator is repeated via a tv screen in the main station concourse, which is very useful

For clockwise platforms between High Street Kensington and Paddington the distinction between Circle and District trains is meant to aid mobility impaired passengers as Circle line trains should give cross platform interchange at Edgware Road.

The website (and apps) for finding the next tubes don't work from Notting Hill Gate (and I think other stations from High Street Kensington to Paddington). I asked the author of one of the iPhone app why this was and he said it was an issue TFL have that won't be sorted out for years.

Irritating!

I've used Paddington's H&C platforms (16&17) and it has an New-ish orange LED indicator (partially hidden on one side because of boarding around the building works). It usually says 'check front of train' for westbound with a time, even though they can only go to Hammersmith, and has next 2 eastbound with a time, I believe. Maybe the blue boarding is covering it now? Not sure how accurate the timings are though.










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