please empty your brain below
|
I know what you're saying DG, but surely pay more-go faster, is a fairly standard thing in public transport?
Mark | Homepage | 11.04.11 - 8:28 a.m. | #
|
Surely putting it on the Oyster map (but then saying you can't use oyster to go on it) *is* promoting it, as they could have just left it off the map altoegether... that would be relly trying not to advertise it.
Geofftech | Homepage | 11.04.11 - 8:47 a.m. | #
|
But why not let you use Oyster and pay the higher fare? Same with heathrow express. It could deduct the fare before you board like a bus.
X | 11.04.11 - 8:51 a.m. | #
|
You should say "The Department for Transport are so determined to get a return...", because they set out the High Speed fare rules before the current Southeastern franchise was let. Any money being made from this will be destined for government coffers.
Graham | 11.04.11 - 9:02 a.m. | #
|
Paying £5.40 to save 19 minutes and all the queues and scrum on the underground sounds like excellent Value to me. Think what a taxi would cost!
As I often say here, you people who live in London, with your excellent, cheap, public transport don't know you are born. £5.40 might sound a lot comparatively, but that's because the rest of the system is very highly subsidised.
Blue Witch | Homepage | 11.04.11 - 9:30 a.m. | #
|
Can you use Oyster on slow Heathrow Services? I didn't think that was included.
It's hardly London's fault that the people running the countryside don't invest in public transport. Unless, perhaps, you regard "bankers" as synonymous with "london"
ian | 11.04.11 - 10:41 a.m. | #
|
Ian - you are correct: The list of Oyster exclusions includes "Heathrow Connect services between Hayes & Harlington and Heathrow". (You can use Oyster between Paddington and H&H)
Or did you mean the REALLY slow service via Acton Town?
Conversely, you can use HEx and HC, but not the Underground, for free transfer between the Heathrow terminals.
Timbo | 11.04.11 - 11:14 a.m. | #
|
I used the High Speed link quite a while back. Admittedly the bus journey and the long walk from the main station threw things, but it was a fast, comfortable and highly enjoyable service.
It's also a lot less cramped than the Central Line.
Silent Hunter | Homepage | 11.04.11 - 11:15 a.m. | #
|
Crossrail will have standard oyster fares, at least in the core section, as there will be no gates between it and the rest of the underground network.
Chris | 11.04.11 - 11:56 a.m. | #
|
Blue Witch - in St Petersburg, a journey on their Metro costs something like 50p. That's cheap. Meanwhile in London, a cash tube far between four stops can cost £4.00. That's not cheap.
Andrew Bowden | Homepage | 11.04.11 - 12:18 p.m. | #
|
2 points:
1. If Westfield is up-market enough, and if DB are allowed to run through trains from Germany in the future, it is conceivable their services will call at SI and provide at least some passing trade from continental tourists. Purely speculative, of course.
2. The DLR connection here will, of course, be on the Oyster/Travelcard network and as a result will probably be heaving most days of the week. I am unsure of the service pattern for the new branch but I suspect it will become a very busy section on the new route, especially with people getting on at Stratford having taken a 'normal' surface train from central London to avoid the fares you describe.
Siwi | 11.04.11 - 12:40 p.m. | #
|
Andrew Bowden - do you have to run a car, or are you lucky enough to live in an area where there is subsidised public transport? With diesel at £6.40 a gallon round here, and no public transport, I have no sympathy at all for those who moan about the public transport they are luckily enough to have subsidised by the rest of us. Mostly car drivers, AKA cash cows. Sorry.
Blue Witch | Homepage | 11.04.11 - 1:45 p.m. | #
|
Soory DG but you're wrong about "Every other London rail journey from zone 1 to zone 3 costs less than £3 with Oyster". It doesn't apply to main line stations. A peak time journey from say Temple (Zone 1) to my local station Alexandra Palace costs £4.10 and £3.20 off-peak both with Oyster.
dg writes: Ah, you're right, I'm wrong. Once you leave the tube/DLR/Overground network, prices shoot up a bit. I've given the paragraph a major rewrite.
Mike | 11.04.11 - 2:27 p.m. | #
|
Blue Witch - I live in London. As such I live in an area with good public transport and I don't own a car.
Indeed I have never owned a car and haven't driven one since 2005. And that was in Iceland. I commute by tube; I travel by train extensively - here and abroad. I even took the train (and ferry) to Ireland.
However I don't buy your problems with subsidy. Why? Because dude, I am subsidising the road network out of my taxes. I haven't used a motorway for years, but I pay towards each and every one of them.
I don't moan and complain. I just get on and live my life.
If you have crap public transport, I suggest you take it up with your MP. Maybe if everyone who has crap public transport did likewise, you might actually see something change. Other countries manage it - the rural train and bus network in Switzerland is amazing.
Andrew Bowden | Homepage | 11.04.11 - 2:33 p.m. | #
|
its all about Return On Investment (ROI0
Abu | Homepage | 11.04.11 - 3:30 p.m. | #
|
Why will the DLR station at International be "heaving?" Most of Westfield will be nearer the Regional station, where all the connections are made except for HS1. Unless Eurostar will call there, I can't see much use being made of the DLR SI extension.
Incidentally, Westfield's own map of connections makes interesting reading: http://uk.westfield.com/stratfordcity/leasing/transport/
As well as the apparent connection between the two DLR routes (seemingly allowing trains to run from Poplar to Canning Town via Stratford), it would appear that the Stansted-Stratford service is to be operated by C2C and extended to Fenchurch Street!
Timbo | 11.04.11 - 3:53 p.m. | #
|
The cost of getting around these days is crazy....
hotelspam | 11.04.11 - 4:28 p.m. | #
|
I am told (by a Crossrail top brass who should know) that it will be “oystered”
John | 11.04.11 - 6:03 p.m. | #
|
John - that's mighty reassuring, thanks.
diamond geezer | Homepage | 11.04.11 - 6:11 p.m. | #
|
Maybe prices will change after the Olympic rush and Westfield novelty is over, in way of keeping it an attractive option. Before then people will pay the prices as that's where the action will be.
CornishCockney | 11.04.11 - 6:23 p.m. | #
|
Re Crossrail pricing, here's an old District Dave thread confirming the position:
http://districtdave.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=crossrail&thread=10001&page=1
centraluser | Homepage | 11.04.11 - 7:34 p.m. | #
|
I can understand Heathrow Connect charging a premium over Oyster fares when it uses a separate and privately built tunnel into the airport...but once Crossrail opens it seems daft that the massively expensive tunnel under Central London will carry no fare premium, whereas the small, and by then 20 year old BAA Heathrow branch will carry a premium! Shouldn't the Heathrow branch be integrated into the TfL or National Rail system?
Mikey C | 11.04.11 - 10:20 p.m. | #
|
The whole Southeastern franchise is geared towards income from HS1 - thanks to decisions made by the last government.
Unfortunately, SE has come unstuck because of the delayed opening of developments at Stratford and Ebbsfleet, so the government's subsidising it through to the end of the franchise.
darryl | Homepage | 11.04.11 - 10:43 p.m. | #
|
The reason for making HS1 massively expensive between St Pancras and Stratford is roughly the same reason why you can't get a Virgin train from Euston to Watford: otherwise, everyone commuting from Stratford would use it. Which would make the train grossly overcrowded for the first ten minutes of its journey (risking stopping Kent commuters from actually being able to get home in the evening), and then empty for the rest of it. HS1 wasn't designed to transport people from St Pancras to Stratford, and so it isn't set up to do so, and so the fares deter people from doing so.
The reason for not applying premium fares to Crossrail is that the whole point of its existence is to take pressure off the Tube, allowing people to make direct journeys instead of changing irrespective of the end of London they live at. This would be undermined totally if fares were higher than the Tube, so they won't be.
LHR is a different story altogether. Yes, the LHR tunnel should be integrated into National Rail - but the Tories stupidly allowed it to be built and owned by BAA, Labour sadly never tried to nationalise it, and the Tories certainly won't.
john b | Homepage | 12.04.11 - 4:41 a.m. | #
|
So Stratford International is the Watford Junction of East London? That sort-of makes sense.
And yet outside rush hours, especially at weekends, HS1 runs pretty much empty between St Pancras and Stratford. It's a great shame that all this capacity is being wasted, purely for the benefit of Kent commuters in one direction only for 30 hours a week.
diamond geezer | Homepage | 12.04.11 - 7:52 a.m. | #
|
The reason almost nobody buys a ticket at Stratford Int is because you can't get there on the free bus unless you've already bought your ticket. In the past you had walk a very long way to the regional ticket office. Managment seem to have realised this is not right and their solution .... perhaps allow you to travel to the Int. ticket office? No far too sensible instead employ 2 roving ticket clerks to sell tickets to allow you to get on the free bus to Int. No wonder the fares are so high.
Tony | 13.04.11 - 10:14 a.m. | #
|
Just out of interest - is that map missing some symbols? I'm wondering why anyone would build a station which theoretically services an international port, without making it 'step-free'?
Or is that just me, stupidly assuming that commuters going to that station might, perhaps have luggage?
DebF | 11.08.11 - 2:23 p.m. | #
|
|
|
TridentScan v2.10.0 | Privacy Policy
|