please empty your brain below
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If only the tube map 'aps' on the 'iPhone' were as current...there are some very dodgy versions out there. I still think there should be a campaign/ twitter / facebook etc to bring back Strand station. [no 'The' please].
Strandman | 11.12.09 - 8:21 a.m. | #
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Someone must have thought of this before, but why on earth don't they rename one of the Edgware Road stations? Eg the District/Circle could be Chapel Street.
Tim | 11.12.09 - 9:20 a.m. | #
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A local councillor tried to get Edgware Road (Bakerloo) renamed as Church Street Market a couple of years ago. TfL almost always refuse these requests because of the cost of replacing signs and maps everywhere.
diamond geezer | Homepage | 11.12.09 - 9:39 a.m. | #
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Ah, well they'll have to fix it next time, won't they? You (and the people at District Dave's forum) are providing a valuable service to tfl, although one thinks that they ought to do the job better themselves.
But you're right: putting the Bakerloo line on top of the Circle - no, you can't do that (I think the Central briefly went over the Circle at Liverpool Street sometime in the 90s); and the presentation of Paddington....is unhelpful in the extreme.
Oh that the bravery of the September map has been sacrificed, and that the bloody blue blobs haven't
Venichka | 11.12.09 - 10:03 a.m. | #
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The now-old riverless map has only just appeared on the platform at Dagenham Heathway, replacing a much faded map of unknown vintage.
Dave | Homepage | 11.12.09 - 10:04 a.m. | #
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The Bakerloo going above the Circle is just reverting to "how it used to be" a few years back. Makes sense.
Agree about Paddington.
Carlbob | Homepage | 11.12.09 - 10:05 a.m. | #
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Ah - to clarify, my objection is not to the Bakerloo being ABOVE the Circle; but rather it being printed on top of the Circle (and H&C) where the lines cross.
As every Mornington Crescent affectionado would know, according to the 1927 consensus, any instance of a deep-level tube line (e.g. Bakerloo) crossing a sub-surface line (e.g. Circle & H&C), where the former is deeper at that point (as it is here), should be depicted in a way that matches reality (as should lines crossing one another in general)
Venichka | 11.12.09 - 10:28 a.m. | #
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Just a thought, here, but with the new arrangement of the circle line, do we actually *need* a Hammersmith and City line at all? It's a relatively new creation to begin with - 1988 I believe. Prior to that it was a branch of the Metropolitan line.
Audrey | 11.12.09 - 11:26 a.m. | #
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"TfL almost always refuse these requests because of the cost of replacing signs and maps everywhere."
Wasn't there some station renaming going on in Shepherd's Bush only about a year ago?
nordstar | 11.12.09 - 1:12 p.m. | #
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That change was introduced at the same time as the opening of Wood Lane, so the overheads would have been lower.
Simon K | 11.12.09 - 2:19 p.m. | #
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Sweet Lord! Why has Max Roberts not yet pronounced his verdict on the new map yet?
Alan | 11.12.09 - 2:35 p.m. | #
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On the plus side, they'e removed the box next to Watford Junction and put it in a separate "Special Fares Apply" background...
D-Notice | Homepage | 11.12.09 - 3:20 p.m. | #
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So all the good work done in simplifying the map has already gone... woo...
OK, so the Thames should be on there, but other than that they should have just left it as it was (with the extended Circle of course!)
RG | 11.12.09 - 5:36 p.m. | #
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and working on TFL's logic, there should also be daggers on ALL the other northern line stations both the Edgware and High Barnet branches, because you might assume that the solidly flowing black lines means you can get trains from both of those all the way through down both lines to Morden.
so yeah, they still don't get 'uncluttering' do they?
i. leave the river in (London identity, nice)
2. keep the zones (essential for oyster season holders like me)
3. lose the blue blobs
4. remove ALL the daggers! places like Chesham should then NOT be connected with a through line, but a connector instead, sorted.
geofftech | Homepage | 11.12.09 - 5:44 p.m. | #
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Simon K: true...
I suppose they could've theoretically bundled that change in now that every permanent diagram, etc. around the Circle line needs replacing - but presumably there is very little appetite to rename the station that is the linchpin of the new Circle now.
nordstar | 11.12.09 - 6:08 p.m. | #
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"Wasn't there some station renaming going on in Shepherd's Bush only about a year ago?"
There was. It went from Shepherd's Bush to Shepherd's Bush Market. But TfL owns the market and so the cost of replacing the signage is outweighed by the gain from inherent advertising! Also, as someone else said, Wood Lane opened at the same time.
Chris | 11.12.09 - 7:02 p.m. | #
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Still wrong about Canary Wharf. There isn't a single interchange there between the DLR and the tube, which sits between the two DLR stations (and if anything nearer Heron Quays).
Autolycus | Homepage | 11.12.09 - 7:43 p.m. | #
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On a positive note, Earl's Court has reverted to its 2002 design, with the District lines simplified and a 33\\% reduction in blobbiness.
Tim Frost | Homepage | 11.12.09 - 7:47 p.m. | #
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The river is not 'clutter'. It's the river, it's a vital reference point, and it should NEVER have been removed in the first place. Just because the Daily Mail are morons doesn't mean they weren't right about this. Even a stopped clock...
The last map was stupid, getting rid of useful information and creating a load of pointless white space. This is much better.
Big Dave | 11.12.09 - 8:12 p.m. | #
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I agree with Big Dave. Maps aren't supposed to look pretty. They're supposed to present us with geographical information.
The minimalist map may have been a nice, pretty work of art, but as a map it just plain failed. It's good to see some of the information being put back in.
solar penguin | Homepage | 11.12.09 - 9:18 p.m. | #
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also, the word on the street is that the revenue protection teams were MOST keen to have the zones be reinstated, on advice which states that they would probably lose in court if they tried to prosecute someone for having the wrong zone ticket because as the nornal / most frequently used map did not show any zones - it would be 'fair' for average punter to assume that the zonal system no longer existed ...
geofftech | Homepage | 12.12.09 - 8:14 a.m. | #
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Can't believe all those daggers! That's absurd. OK for really key issues, like a station that's not open all day, but not because you may have to change! You'd stick them all over the place if you followed that logic.
SELondoner | 12.12.09 - 11:07 a.m. | #
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How poorly superimposed is that reference grid too; it goes over the station names and so many stations are right on a grid line - look at the central line for starters. And which square is Paddington in?
PG | 12.12.09 - 11:22 a.m. | #
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Geofftech's points on RPIs and zones make a lot of sense; I'm embarrassed not to have thought of them before
The river stuff is still nonsense. The Tube map is a schematic diagram of the Tube network; it no more needs the river on it than it needs contour lines, illustrations of major landmarks, motorways, or haunts of notorious London criminals.
john b | Homepage | 12.12.09 - 2:37 p.m. | #
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Hopefully, after September's over-simplified map, and the over-complicated maps before it, TfL will now achieve what most people would consider an optimum level of detail on the tube map. However, judging by the dagger situation, it doesn't look good...
Andrewh | 12.12.09 - 6:57 p.m. | #
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I completely agree about the daggers. Especially in the inner 2 zones. They really add to the clutter and it is hard to think that they would actually help a great percentage of the map users.
You do take this seriously but I enjoyed the read this morning!
Gareth | 16.12.09 - 9:20 a.m. | #
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