please empty your brain below
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OMG WTF!!!
Still Anon | 02.07.18 - 7:21 a.m. | #
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Brilliantly curated, you can't beat a disruptive blog post to get the week off to a good start.
Waterhouse | 02.07.18 - 7:22 a.m. | #
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Best part about the FOI request is that whoever gathered the data exported a load of blank rows at the bottom of the CSV.
Kirk | 02.07.18 - 7:30 a.m. | #
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Which begs the question ... how many of these journeys are being made, and at what cost to TfL - I.e. how much are they losing out on by being kind and Not charging the whole fare ...
Geofftech | 02.07.18 - 7:30 a.m. | #
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There is also a cluster of Z2 to Z2 via Z1 overrides between Warwick Avenue etc and Royal Oak etc where the distances as the crow flies between the Bakerloo and Hammersmith branch stations are relatively short but the only practical route is via Z1.
dg adds: Here's the map for Royal Oak
DavidC | 02.07.18 - 8:01 a.m. | #
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A future working for TimeOut or the Metro awaits!
Andrew Bowden | Homepage | 02.07.18 - 8:13 a.m. | #
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but but why?!?
| 02.07.18 - 8:32 a.m. | #
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I can feel something shifting. It might just be a paradigm.
Ben | 02.07.18 - 8:48 a.m. | #
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As Euston to Mornington Crescent is a 10 minutes walk why not saving £2.40 and improving personal fitness?
That would be a bargain...
Hmm... This might be an idea tackling obesity: If you exit a zone 1/2 station without riding more than one stop, you'll have to pay a £2 supplement (exceptions apply) ;-)
Welcome | 02.07.18 - 8:53 a.m. | #
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My FoI request has found some use!
I don't know why TfL keeps these journeys so secret - I would have thought that £0.50 off in peak times would be a vote winner for people near these stations.
A Harkness | 02.07.18 - 9:19 a.m. | #
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@DavidC, could this explain the mysterious Warwick Avenue to "Zone 1" OSI in TfL's OSI list? (row 78).
Lurker | 02.07.18 - 9:24 a.m. | #
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This is not a recent innovation either. Many years ago I went from High Street Kensington to Hammersmith with a paper ticket issued by a machine specifically for that journey. I was "caught" by ticket inspectors who didn't understand these special fares and demanded payment of the excess.
kev | 02.07.18 - 9:42 a.m. | #
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That... makes my head hurt. What on earth are they basing it on? It's not track distance, it's not straight line distance, changes are allowed.
Chz | 02.07.18 - 9:52 a.m. | #
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But do grandmothers in <verylocationinourspammydatabase> know this?
I think it calls for a relentless google ad campaign with a picture of a wrinkled old woman and the name of !
drD | Homepage | 02.07.18 - 10:56 a.m. | #
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i live on the border of Z1-2, and didn't even realise that i was benefiting from this discount !
although, i normally hit the daily and weekly Z12 cap, so TfL get their full money from me in the end !
ADS | Homepage | 02.07.18 - 10:56 a.m. | #
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It does not seem to occur to DG that a likely result of his 'clever' expose within TfL could be for them to promptly cancel all these 'concessions'.
It is easy to be "too clever by half" over things like this, the current regular beneficiaries will not be pleased if they lose the benefit due to the activity of a "smart-arse".
prptram | 02.07.18 - 12:21 p.m. | #
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This is a long-standing concession which TfL has been offering for years. All the reduced prices are publicly visible via the Single Fare Finder. TfL will not be cancelling anything.
diamond "smart-arse" geezer | Homepage | 02.07.18 - 12:34 p.m. | #
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If you’re going to (bizarrely) insult the author, at least go all the way and do him the courtesy of removing the quote marks.
Madison | 02.07.18 - 1:09 p.m. | #
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prptram I’m afraid to say you clearly aren’t smart enough yourself to work out that TFL aren’t going to cancel something that they themselves have devised just because it has been publicised
Brian | 02.07.18 - 4:51 p.m. | #
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that is not a saving because it based on something that is over-priced to start with. it same with bus fares and the "hopper" option. anyway, enough of this...i off to the supermarket; they got a buy one get one free offer on.
Grumpy Anon | 02.07.18 - 5:27 p.m. | #
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From today, TfL's Journey Planner now includes fares. For example, the Short Distance Cross Boundary Journey from Euston to Mornington Crescent is always £2.40, never £2.90.
diamond geezer | Homepage | 02.07.18 - 5:36 p.m. | #
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Not exactly a secret. These short distance mileage based cross zone boundary fares have existed since the Underground created zonal fares.
I know this because one of my first jobs with LU was in the team that created all the ticket machine and gate data. I also had to stand at the old fashioned multi fare machine and press every ticket / station combination and shout out the fare while a colleague checked that the fare was indeed correct. Can't be many people who've checked every fare on the tube network (albeit back in the late 80s).
The list does look a bit longer these days than back then but the outer zone quirks have gone as TfL have flattened the fare scale. There used to be a lovely odd one on the West Ruislip branch of the Central Line - from Northolt to Perivale if my memory is working.
PC | 02.07.18 - 6:59 p.m. | #
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You are amazing!
(no name given) | 02.07.18 - 9:14 p.m. | #
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Contrary to the second nb, there are a few SDCBJs (catchy!) involving Notting Hill Gate and Earl's Court on the 1/2 boundary. All of them seem to be to stations in Z2 that you can't reach without entering Z1 (e.g. NHG to West Ken).
Geoff | 02.07.18 - 10:01 p.m. | #
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Thank you Paul. It's not kept secret, just not relevant unless you make that particular journey. Part of the problem is that the Travelcard zone map is just that; it's not meant to be a way of working out the single fare as there are so many exceptions.
Ralph Ayres | 02.07.18 - 10:44 p.m. | #
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Hmm. To sort of summarise: the zones have two rather separate functions. One is to firmly and definitively stipulate where you can and cannot travel with a "Zones A to B travelcard". No exceptions in this role.
The other is to make it possible without access to the internet (provided you have previously printed out several pages of fares guff) to set an upper bound on the fare between any given pair of stations.
DG is quite right, though, to show up the fact that this is an upper bound, not an exact fare. This has hitherto been very little known.
Malcolm | 02.07.18 - 11:26 p.m. | #
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Am I misremembering, or did there also used to be point-to-point short cross-boundary season tickets, for people who wanted to save on the cost of buying two whole zones on their Travelcard?
martin | 03.07.18 - 6:39 a.m. | #
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I'm off to that contactless cheese festival later, thanks for the tip-off!
martin | 03.07.18 - 6:40 a.m. | #
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