please empty your brain below
Definitely an improvement, all round.
Interesting that the National Rail symbol is in blue, too - first time ever? It's been in red as long as I remember...
But...Bring back the station index (and thus the grid)
and... above all....BIN THE BLOODY BLOBS! Their presence is above all political, and not of particular help to anyone who might need to know about such access requirements.
I don't recall any previous occasion on which the poster map has differed from the pocket version, though...
(I think Acton Town and the GOBLIN both look kind of messy, alas)
Pity they've not extended the map to include the West Croydon extension, would have been interesting to see how they're planning to shoe-horn that one into the design.
Of course, just dropping all the overground stuff would simplify things, and remove the conflict with the thing being called a "Tube Map"
West India Quay: needs a dagger
Still mystery daggers at Charing Cross and Leicester Square. Are they referring to the walk to Covent Garden (then Holborn needs to be flagged too)? Why would someone going to Covent Garden read the warnings for the nearby stations? Are they referring to the Northern Line split?
Early closure daggers (e.g. Woodford to Hainault) by default imply that non-flagged lines have a later service than 24:00, they don't.
Actual errors on every Tube Map since June 2006, not good.
Do the ELL stations really need eight daggers? Isn't it obvious the line isn't working from the pecking and the key?
They are back to showing lines, not services at Mill Hill, Chesham, and Woodford, but the ugly and incorrect mess at Earl's Court is still there.
Also did you see that on the card folder, Tower Hill is still for Fenchurch Street, but Embankment is no longer for Charing Cross, and Euston Square is no longer for Euston.
It's still a crushed, kinked, unbalanced design, based on the same dimensions as 1933 when East London ended at Bow.
[N.B. before any other commentators jump on me and say 'no, this Tube Map is a great design and a work of genius, just like the 1933 original', make sure that you have made it clear what your evaluation criteria are, so that you can tell the difference between a good design and a bad design that follows Beck's rules!]
Simple *ISN'T* good. Simple is dumbed-down for idiots. The old map assumed we were intelligent enough to read it and understand all the information on it. This new map doesn't. It's a map for the hard of thinking.
Still that's the general trend in just about everything these days. Why should TfL be any different?
Well done, DG, for fighting this fight so prominently. I *knew* TfL people read this blog...
And does anyone railing against the blue blobs actually know anyone in a wheelchair? My Dad uses the map to plan routes for days out with my Mum. True, you often need to follow this up by getting more information, but the point of the map to HIM is that it illustrates a range of possibilities.
South Tottenham is still in the wrong place. To the north instead of south of Seven Sisters. This could have been corrected if the Victoria Line had been straightened between Finsbury Park and Walthamstow..
Otherwise - very user friendly
As for the big blue 'wheelchair' blobs, I can understand why TfL would want to indicate which tube stations are wheelchair-friendly, but I think, for example, National Rail interchanges will be of far more relevance to most people, yet the symbol for that is far smaller. Can't they just keep the white circle for interchanges, and move the wheelchair symbol beside the station name, alongside those for National Rail, Tramlink, airport and riverboat interchanges?
I think the zones will be retained in the more comprehensive London Connections map, so if you want to know what zones you're travelling through, you can always refer to that.
The new map is far better in my opinion, especially as I noticed the disappearance of 'for the O2' beside North Greenwich. Why promote that but not the London Eye beside Waterloo or Westminster, for example?
Genius.
Just what every other marketeer/PR bod already does.
And does Epping still have a big blue blob? Because, if a train arrives on the far-side platform (which it will if there is one sitting in the platform on the exit side), there is a very steep footbridge to cross, with no alternative. So, still not accurate.
I knew there was a reason I keep old tube maps...
I don't think they can correct the South Tottenham anomaly without making V line and London Overground wiggle all round each other, which they are not going to want to do.
The sacrifice of geographical accuracy for route-planning clarity is the triumph of Harry Beck's idea.
On a related note, has anyone seen the Paris Metro map recently? Big mess!! When are they going to sort that out?!
I think the interchanges are the best improvement though. Wood Lane and White City are right next door to each other. The Edgware Roads aren't that far apart. They're interchanges, just not ones at the same building.
Generally? It's good to see what a clean map looks like, but I think it's gone too far. Bring back the river, and the index needs zonal information (the poster probably needs an index somewhere also). Yet it's also not far enough: please, can we not at least have the wheelchairs as NR style icons?
If the zones still exist and are to be applied when ticket inspectors want to check your ticket, then they should be shown on the map.
With something like 300 stations it is stupid to remove the index. Would you take it out of a London A-Z and make people guyess where the streets are?
The East London line is closed. You can't get there on a train. Why is it on a map which is supposed to help you plan a journey - this journey can't be made.
Someone needs sacking.
Maybe there needs to be a slightly different symbol for interchanges involving more than one station. Maybe white dots joined by a dotted line... or has that already been tried?
I can understand people getting upset about not being told that you cannot use the southbound platform from the Bank direction during peak-hours but this is where tough decisions have to be made. The inconvenience of someone not knowing this is minor. It will not fundamentally affect their journey plans and probably add only a couple of minutes to their journey time. Keep the clutter out so that the user unfamiliar with it can start to comprehend the general outline of the system.
I imagine all those who have commented here, including myself, are (very) familiar with London and the map. Therefore could be termed 'armchair users'.
The map is primarily designed for those don't know the system and want to get around asap. I imagine the new design is as I said before, user friendly (for quick journey decisions), but I do accept bollox' point about the ELL. That is rather silly.
2) I actually found the airport symbols helpful... I'd never considered that you could travel to Gatwick / Luton from London Bridge / Blackfriars / Farringdon - gazing at the map made me realise the possibility.
If someone is going to a destination that is geographically halfway between two stations (or, if there is not much difference), knowing which zone each station is in will influence the person's journey, and they will choose the cheaper destination. Not having this information on the map means that people may choose sub-optimal routes.And I think the lack of zones is going to trip up and upset many frequent users too.
Otherwise, I can't wait to see it. Will have to get me mum to send one.
Frustrated!
Love the discussion though... Feeling a bit anxious about the disppearance of the Thames...
EP
The only important principle here should be whether the inclusion or omission of something helps or hinders people when making a journey.
The zones, the index and the river all help. Zones show you whether your ticket is valid for the journey you are planning. LU have signs everywhere saying that it needs to be or they will penalty fare you, so why take away the easiest way to check? The index and the river orient you, the basic job of a map.
The wheelchair symbols are not simply designed to show wheelchair accessibility, they signify to anyone with a mobility restriction that the marked station will be easier to negotiate, likewise the distance markers for the interchanges which are not self contained.
Virtually no-one (I expect) commenting so far is a Tube novice who needs all the help they can get, we're all most likely familiar or very familiar with the Tube. The novices will look at this and think where the hell am I. For those more familiar, for whom the map is only an occasional reference, looking up an unfamiliar destination (but no index, yay!) or checking if our Oyster card is valid to Tottenham Hale (what zone is that in?) is our main concern. Both options rendered much more difficult = map FAIL. We used to be able to walk up to the map and find the info we need quickly and in one place, without having to ask staff or check another piece of information - can't do that now = map FAIL.
It may look great, but that is not what it is there for. It is not a piece of art. If you want a copy of the Tube map that looks great so you can admire it, buy it on a Tea Towel, mug or fridge magnet. The station map is to plan journeys and all they have done with this one is make that harder to do for every user.
I agree that the zones need to come back though. It's definitely required when planning a journey. I can get from Stratford to Willesden Junction via Overground (Zone 2 only) or Jubilee Line (Zone2-Zone1-Zone2) - from what I've read there's no way I can tell that from the new map.
Also why do some stations just have the white blob - e.g Euston Square, whilst others have it with the National Rail symbol?
I do think it is a vast improvement and much clearer. but it does seem to have anomalies.
I think the wheel chair symbols are a good thing as they demonstrate accessibility to some degree though perhaps the key could mention referring to the accessibility map. It may look better if they were a different shade or colour to the Piccadilly line.
Finally I think zones are unnecessary as it's easy to find ticket prices at ticket machines or ticket windows. Using Oyster you don't even need to know the full journey price - just the minimum price to enter at the station you are traveling from. Surely most people buying a travelcard and wanting to avoid zone one will check this out as it will be for frequent journeys (i.e getting to work) and if you want to save money, you'd check the cost first anyway. The vast majority wanting to save on a single journey will use a bus for the whole journey so the tube map and zones is totally irrelevant.
Perhaps it could be noted beside the Overground notes, that Overground avoids Zone 1 as this is probably where money could be saved.
- they have exposed the new map, two specimens, in the ticket hall
- after three days, both maps were replaced by "high frequency services" maps with river and zones
- after another couple of days, the ticket hall was tonight again graced by two copies of the new zoneless thameless map.
Which, I am afraid, is there to stay...
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