please empty your brain below
Love your work, as always, and I'm sorry to be one of those people that comment only when they see something that might be wrong. But!

Can Shadwell DLR & Shadwell OG be considered to be the same station? My evidence:
- The tube map shows a dotted line "Under a 10 minutes walk between stations", implying that they are two stations.
- Bethnal Green OG & Central Line, a possible second example where two separate stations have the same name.

A similar question might also apply to Canary Wharf.

When is it one station with an external interchange, and when is it two stations that share a name?

Matt | 21.11.23 - 7:20 a.m. | #

Lovely. This is what I like to see.

Scott | Homepage | 21.11.23 - 7:35 a.m. | #

There are numerous cases where the question: "is this one station or two?" arises. Bank/Monument, Liverpoolgate etc. The best answer for this challenge is the one that makes the challenge do-able.

Malcolm of Kent | 21.11.23 - 7:42 a.m. | #

I'd award you huge style points for taking advantage of the Elizabeth line's long platforms to the full.

Chris | 21.11.23 - 8:09 a.m. | #

Quick, before the Overground becomes more than one line...

Betterbee | 21.11.23 - 8:12 a.m. | #

One could argue that the Overground is no longer a tube line, but it was in 2003.

Similarly for Crossrail.

dg writes: That's why my challenge was "one stop on every tube line - plus the DLR, Overground and Crossrail"

Southern Heights (Light Railway) | 21.11.23 - 8:28 a.m. | #

Could it be achieved in the opposite direction ?

I would guess so (unless you know differently).

Petras409 | 21.11.23 - 8:33 a.m. | #

not too long - definitely niche - read all the way through

Caroline | 21.11.23 - 9:57 a.m. | #

I laughed out loud when I got to that "too long: too niche" comment today. touché. :-))

Marmaduke Jinks | 21.11.23 - 10:23 a.m. | #

I'm sorry, I'm being thick - what's reason why Oxford Circus to Green Park is the only feasible Victoria line section?

Fergal | 21.11.23 - 10:32 a.m. | #

If you're using Oyster without a Travelcard and do actually leave the station you started at then the cost will not unreasonably be for two incomplete (ie max fare) journeys, and because you've taken so long ending at a nearby station will do the same. Contactless would I think in this example assume that you went to Shadwell then back again so split it there and charge for those two journeys. A paper ticket would have to be a return - memories of being caught out on a Circle line party back in the 1970s! - so more expensive off-peak than payg max fares.

Andrew S | 21.11.23 - 10:45 a.m. | #

Shadwell - if TfL regard it as an interchange, then its an interchange.

If you disagree then Hammersmnith and Paddington are waiting for you outside.

Still Anon | 21.11.23 - 10:53 a.m. | #

Fergal - For it to work you have to only use interchanges to which you can travel one stop from another interchange, and from which you can travel, on a different line, one stop to another interchange. If you try to do this on any section of the Victoria Line other than Green Park- Oxford Circus you will reach a dead end (no interchange except to a line you have already been on) after no more than two changes.

South of Victoria there is no section of the Victoria Line with an interchange at both ends, so you cannot go from one interchange to another in one stop.

You can't use Victoria itself as it is two stops in either direction on the District/Circle from the next interchange. (You can't do District one stop and Circle another because the District is needed between Whitechapel and Aldgate East)

At both Warren Street and Euston the Victoria Line only interchanges with the Northern Line - the only other interchange with any other line which is one stop from either Warren Street or Euston is Kings Cross, and from Kings Cross there is only one one-stop segment to an interchange with another line from there - Farringdon. Thus you can get from Warren Street to Farringdon, (from where the rest of the network can be reached) but there is no way back to complete the circuit without repeating a line.

South of Victoria or north of Kings Cross there is no section with an interchange at both ends

dg writes: and this is why I didn’t go into detail.

Timbo | 21.11.23 - 11:58 a.m. | #

...nonetheless very helpful. Thanks Timbo!

Fergal | 21.11.23 - 12:53 p.m. | #

I am agog at the rule-bending at Liverpool Street/Moorgate. I will be cancelling my Direct Debit and writing to my MP about this.

Karen Warbles | 21.11.23 - 1:39 p.m. | #

Genius - I'm definitely doing this

Johnny Topaz | 21.11.23 - 1:55 p.m. | #

Sounds like a fun challenge to while away a cold and / or rainy day!
But thanks, I don't think I'll bother!!

Cornish Cockney | 21.11.23 - 2:20 p.m. | #

We could call it the SuperTubeLoop.

diamond geezer | Homepage | 21.11.23 - 2:23 p.m. | #

Maximally exterior loop as a future challenge? Including Overground.

* Each terminal station only once
* Using buses/trains to interconnect terminal stations where needed...

dg interrupts: no

MilesT | 21.11.23 - 2:45 p.m. | #

You've inspired me to try and fit Thameslink into the loop, but I've had no success yet.

TW | 21.11.23 - 6:55 p.m. | #

You appear to have broken (or not taken advantage) of the rules pertaining to earlier iterations. Explain?

Michael Jones | 21.11.23 - 8:02 p.m. | #

I don't think Thameslink can be fitted in.
You need a stretch which has an interchange with another line at each end, which essentially limits the search to somewhere between West Hampstead and New Cross/New Cross Gate/ Elephant.
BUT No other line serving Kentish Town, Blackfriars, New Cross, New Cross Gate or Elephant has an interchange one stop away. And of course City Thamesink is not an interchange.

West Hampstead is ruled out, as you can't use Kentish Town. (It wouldn't work anyway - you can't get any further than Baker Street without either repeating a line or going more than one stop.)

That leaves the only stretch of Thameslink you could use as Farringdon to St Pancras/Kings Cross. From Kings Cross you can go on to Euston and then Warren Street, but then you're stuck.

And you can't go back to Farringdon, because you've already used all the subsurface lines.

Timbo | 22.11.23 - 12:55 p.m. | #

There is an OSI between Blackfriars and Southwark Underground station which can be chained to reach Waterloo Underground station. See here.

(See comments for evidence that one can chain Blackfriars-Waterloo through Southwark.)

I do not know if this allows Thameslink to be added.

Patrick | 22.11.23 - 2:20 p.m. | #

I wonder what the statisticians in TFL would make of that... either "they didn't leave oxford circus for ages" or if they tracked your phone "oh it's one of those lot"

Alistair Twin | 22.11.23 - 3:23 p.m. | #

Just the sort of content we come here for. Well done.
Completely agree about the irritating "one exit / one entry" route at Shadwell overground. Infuriating and unnecessary.

IslandDweller | 22.11.23 - 3:40 p.m. | #

Patrick, if we are going that far, you can use OSIs to go from Charing Cross to Embankment to Waterloo to Waterloo East to Southwark to Blackfriars. This would create multiple routes including Thameslink such as:

Use multiple OSIs to walk from Embankment to Southwark and take the Jubilee to Waterloo, continue as normal and at Farringdon take Thameslink to St Pancras and the Circle back to Farringdon.

But that's really stretching the boundaries of this challenge and it's turning more into "What's the longest journey composing completely of OSIs?".

TW | 22.11.23 - 6:16 p.m. | #











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