please empty your brain below
That's deplorable, a real reduction in quality of life.

Ogden Gnash | Homepage | 29.05.06 - 11:55 a.m. | #

As one of the myopic, I welcome the simplification ... and as one of the easily confused (despite being a Londoner born & bred) I do find the interim destinations a bit confusing when you're trying to get a bus somewhere unfamiliar. Sorry

Disgruntled | Homepage | 29.05.06 - 12:22 p.m. | #

I am very pleased you have told me this. I would have thought that TfL might have emailed me about this, because I often get the 77A in the morning and this is the first I have heard of it being renumbered. the last thing I need on my return to work is to be confronted with confusion about what bust I actually need!

For the journey I use the 77A - now the 87 - the 88 is a reasonable alternative. Actually, as the 88 stops outside my office I ought to use it, but the 77A (sorry, 87) makes me walk past, or rather into, my favourite coffee shop. And in the evening it takes me to Covent Garden.

Gert | Homepage | 29.05.06 - 2:06 p.m. | #

This probably sounds pathetic but as a child I was always fascinated by 23c (service irregular) appearing on list of bus routes on the back of the bus map (note THE bus map - there was only one).

To add to the fascination I seem to recall that the destination was Beckton Gas Works and I wondered in a childlike way why anyone would want to catch a bus to Beckton Gas Works.

Pedantic of Purley | 29.05.06 - 2:27 p.m. | #

I've checked, like you do, and apparently it was the 100 used to go to Beckton Gas Works, while the 23C terminated at nearby Creekmouth Power Station.

Buses went to more interesting places in those days.

diamond geezer | Homepage | 29.05.06 - 2:36 p.m. | #

Creekmouth Power Station is now probably known as Dagen'ham Quays.

When I was a kid, there used to be buses from Greenwich to Chalk Farm, which sounded like a wonderfully rustic destination (instead of the top end of Camden Town).

[spod]They do have more numbers to play with these days as well - in the olden days, 300 and above were reserved for country buses, possibly the most London-centric term ever.[/spod]

Inspector Sands | Homepage | 29.05.06 - 2:51 p.m. | #

Before the 87 number fell free, they were going to renumber the 77A to 437 - and an earlier plan about six years ago would have split it into two single-deck routes called 377 and 447.
Information now, from blinds to timetables to maps, is totally inadequate. You'd expect a very large reduction in fares to offset the presumable savings made, but no.

Matt | 29.05.06 - 3:58 p.m. | #

Me? I'm fixated on 36C. Glad to say they're still around.

Ham | Homepage | 29.05.06 - 4:24 p.m. | #

They ought to do this with blogs. Perhaps have a BoingBoingB that removes all that tedious babble about DRM and has extra tube maps, or a CuteOverloadC with extra bunnies and no kittens.

quin | Homepage | 29.05.06 - 7:01 p.m. | #

I still refer to the 341 as the 171A even now. Then again, I still call BBC London News "Newsroom Southeast" and forget that Channel 5 exists. Etc.

Old habits die hard.

Nico | Homepage | 29.05.06 - 7:07 p.m. | #

My mum still talks about "Thames News", and even "Thames at Six".

Inspector Sands | Homepage | 29.05.06 - 8:08 p.m. | #

i don't see anything wrong in simplifiying the bus systems...riding the bus is difficult enough for newcomers, or anyone taking a new route. giving unique numbers to different routes makes it easier to decide which bus to take. the maps at the bus shelters tell you what major stops the buses stop at before you board, instead of trying to read the front of the bus (when its bound to be most confusing).
it democratizes the system, but i suppose it doesn't let veteran bus-riding Londoners feel smug about knowing more random technicalities. god forbid.

hackneygal | 29.05.06 - 10:31 p.m. | #

Opal Fruits, Marathons, Jif, etc.. all still exist in my world too!

geofftech | Homepage | 29.05.06 - 11:06 p.m. | #

Veteran bus-riding Londoners had to learn somewhere, though... probably by looking at the fronts of buses.

Inspector Sands | Homepage | 30.05.06 - 3:48 a.m. | #

Just wait until next year when there'll be a voice declaring the name of each stop as the bus approaches. No need for confusing blinds then! I heard that the Circle Line voice is known as Sonya by tube drivers because she gets "onya" nerves - I wonder what the new voice of the buses will be called.

Michael | 30.05.06 - 11:55 a.m. | #

Fucking annoying, that's what the new voice of the buses will be called.

(And I bet it'll mis-pronounce "Plaistow")

Inspector Sands | Homepage | 30.05.06 - 12:09 p.m. | #

It may be 20 years since I was last in London, but I bet I still know which bus goes where.

This will help if/when I return, and, yes, being very myopic, BIG numbers would be a boon.

But why did you put up a picture of the back of a bus?

Jakartass | Homepage | 30.05.06 - 12:11 p.m. | #

Er, that picture of the number 13 is of the front of the bus.

Bus design's changed a lot in the last 20 years too, and not necessarily for the better either.

diamond geezer | Homepage | 30.05.06 - 2:34 p.m. | #

It seems to me that a lot of stuff that is done in the interests of the miniscule percentage of the population who are disabled, while it may indeed help them, makes things a great deal less convenient for everyone else. In other words, it levels down, not up. Lovely.

David Cantrell | Homepage | 31.05.06 - 11:37 a.m. | #

Yes, well Aldwych is really ok, because a fair few people would know where that is, but on a 102 the other day I saw "PENNINE DRIVE Post Office" as the destination.

Now that's really daft. It's not a place, it's a road. And one that isn't even mentioned on the via points. How anyone other than those that live near Pennine Drive would know how far the bus was going is anyones guess.

Mike | 31.05.06 - 3:04 p.m. | #

I've had my email to tell me of the changes.

I disagree with David Cantrell's POV. There are sometimes things done for a small minority which may inconvenience the majority, but, in general, anything that improves ambular accessibility for disabled people improves it for those with buggies and luggage as well as the temporarily restricted.

And increasing the size and clarity of bus numbers is not for a small minority, believe you me! At a bus stop near me it makes a huge difference if you get the 432 or 45 yet they are very difficult to distinguish for almost everybody until they are almost at the bus stop and sometimes they don't bother stopping.

Gert | Homepage | 31.05.06 - 3:42 p.m. | #

The RVAR (Rail vehicle Accessibility Regulations) are making life very difficult for South West trains .

They were unable to extend a waiver they had to use some "older" trains [class 458] where the LED displays for the internal Passenger Information System (PIS) were 3 mm smaller than the requirements (introduced after these trains were built) .

They only needed to use six of them to cover availability for poorer than promised availability of the class 450 Desiros.

But no, those carriages are not to be used. The full story is in Modern Railways (May 06).
It makes you want to weep.

So if your SWT journey is delayed or cancelled at least you knew you can read the PIS from slightly further away then you might otherwise be able to.

There's more about it on Roger Ford's site.

Jon Allen | 01.06.06 - 11:13 p.m. | #

I thought you might enjoy this snippet from my silicon.com weekly round up mailing:

"Has anybody else spotted that Nokia is naming many of its new handsets after London night buses?

There's the N93 with a 3.2 megapixel camera, the N73 with a built-in MP3 player and then of course there's the N77 from Trafalgar Square to Clapham Junction."

Gub Gub | Homepage | 02.06.06 - 11:59 p.m. | #

You need to write a post about the logic (if such there be) of bus lettering. Why are some buses prefixed with letters? What do the letters signify? A google search only seems to comes up with this rather unhelpful thread:
http://london.fridaycities.com/k...versations/
6562

David Brake | Homepage | 26.11.07 - 11:02 a.m. | #











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