please empty your brain below

Reminds me of my first visit to Manchester nearly thirty years ago where I severely embarrassed my host by asking someone on a top deck to stop smoking. Turns out that in that other world that wasn't London, it was perfectly acceptable.
I wonder if there are any other circular bus journeys that DG might acomplish this year?

The 3/3A in Plymouth does a complete circle of the city but runs via the city centre.

The 52/53 in Manchester form a circular route around the city in quite a similar style to the 11. Shame it's not one complete journey.

The 61/62 in Liverpool do as much of a circular as the Mersey will allow.
It may be an urban myth but I believe the reason the western side of Birmingham is nicer is to do with wind direction. Apparently the prevailing wind meant the east of the city was more polluted by factory smoke so the working class were forced to live there while those with money kept the cleaner areas for themselves.

And for students at Birmingham University Harborne is anything but a faceless suburb, it being the home of the infamous 11 pub Harborne Run pub crawl. Conversely the Quaker influence still continues in Bournville and there are still no pubs in the area
In the other world of London night buses, smoking is quite common, though it seems not as common as it is further north.


Surely the "length" of a bus route is the number of miles travelled, not the time. Otherwise the 266 would qualify for the longest bus route in Europe.

When I had no money but had an annual bus pass, I would regularly depart Hammersmith at 1700 and not arrive Brent Cross until 2000 - such that some of my fellow passengers would be given penalty fares as the RPIs didn't believe they were on the same bus that they touched in.

So what are the longest bus routes in England by length? National Express routes etc. don't count. I suggest the X1 from Peterborough to Lowestoft which is 110 miles, although it has recently been broken down into 3 different routes to improve reliability due to roadworks.
Smoking - both tobacco and cannabis - is still quite common on Birmingham buses. Reasons include the lack of an effective system of enforcement (the driver's instructions are to stop the bus, call the police, and wait ... wait ... wait!); and the fact that the social mix of bus passengers in Birmingham is not the same as in London. Many, perhaps most, middle class people in Birmingham rarely travel by bus. They use their cars to commute to work, go to the shops, go out in the evening etc. Travel in Birmingham is dominated by cars to a greater extent, I think, than in any other major British city, and public transport is correspondingly poorer.
I think Whiff's right. Most major industrial cities have their more salubrious areas to the south and west and it must be because of the prevailing winds (writing from south west Sheffield).
As well as Bourneville, the 11 passes close to Moorpool Estate, another garden suburb. More details here http://www.moorpool.com/
@Sarah - yes, I think you are broadly right except that in certain parts, e.g. Newcastle Upon Tyne, the winds (quite strong and unrelenting at times) blow in from the coast. The best places are NE of the city centre.

DG - as you say, you MUST be ever so slightly mad. (perhaps we already know this?)
Great to read about DG on tour.
Wits in Brum often 'amend' the local road name signs around the Sarehole area....as you can imagine.
The also, as you can imagine, amend Dogpool Lane - not on the 11 route, but close to it.
The east/west divide is even more marked in London, where not only the prevailing winds but the river run from west to east.

There are many supposedly "circular bus routes (DG recently described the R5/R10 pair) but most of them are out-and-round-and-back (or "lollipop"-shaped) and so have a definite terminus (but only one of them).

However, some of the London Sighseeing tours are hop-on-hop-off continuous circles .

Lincoln also has a circular bus route.
Ah Brum. I lived there for over ten years and have friends in Kings Heath, Harborne and Erdington so still find plenty of reasons to use the 11. Of Brum's two circular bus routes it serves relatively better-off districts; try the 'Inner Circle' route 8 fora properly edgy ride!
It almost the bus version of the M25 motorway!
Not been on many buses outside of London...and to be honest in this case the London number 11 seems the better choice for a "round trip".
Adam S "The 3/3A in Plymouth does a complete circle of the city but runs via the city centre."

If I were DG,considering a lengthy bus trip in Plymouth (which I'm sure he's not!), I would opt for the Citybus 14, which is a pan handle route, rather than a plain circle. http://www.plymouthbus.co.uk/timetables/
Just under 2 hours in length - four hour out and back trip, beyond the limit of human endurance !
The problem with the 11, as you hinted, is that it crosses numerous arterial roads and is therefore slow slow slow. Consequently it gets more bunching of buses, with 2 or 3 travelling in convoy, than just about any other route in Brum (and also Sandwell, as it does pop out of the city for a short stretch in Bearwood).

Rather charmingly, a number of roads on route were widened and given tree-lined central reservations by Birmingham Corporation in the 1930s specifically for the 11.
I've only ridden short bits of the 11 in Brum. I once made the fateful error of riding the 79 from Wolverhampton to Birmingham. That felt like the bus journey that would never end - so busy and so much congestion. It's easy to see why the tram and trains are so busy on the parallel corridors.
Actually this is not the second longest urban bus service in Europe!

City bus operator Dublin Bus have two routes that (on certain departures) are longer!

Route 65 (http://dublinbus.ie/en/Your-Journey1/Timetables/All-Timetables/65/) from City Centre to Ballyknockan is 28.6 miles long

Route 33 (http://dublinbus.ie/en/Your-Journey1/Timetables/All-Timetables/33/) 07:10 departure from City Centre to Skerries via Portrane is 30.6 miles long making it the second longest urban route in Europe!

The latter departure used to operate to Balbriggan which at 33.9 miles was the longest urban route in Europe.
Quite like the centre of Birmingham, most of the rest I found really depressing.

The best part of the city is the walk along the Worcester and Birmingham canal from the centre out to Bourneville.
Ugh, the Crown & Cushion in Perry Bar - when I lived nearby in Aston in the early 1990s (whilst studying at Aston Uni), I remember an IRA arms cache being discovered in a car in the car park there. Hairy bikers by comparision seem pretty tame!
Interesting read. Though am starting to wonder if you're following me (I lived and blogged in the Outer Hebrides, and you holidayed there. Then lived in Birmingham until recently, and you've now bus-touristed there). If so, I expect you'll be doing a blogged trek across midwest America next :)

Rgds, Silversprite/Wordshore
Circular route no longer operated with continuous buses from 4 July 2021 (sadface)










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