dg comments

please empty your brain below

Yes, I'm sure the queen is a regular reader. I think I might have spotted her checking out Angel Road station recently.

Lorenzo | 15.06.15 - 1:59 a.m. | #

If you look at legislation.gov.uk, most of the Magna Carta has been repealed except for some prepositionary clauses and punctuation.

JQ | 15.06.15 - 5:27 a.m. | #

"Having seen the phenomenal levels of security at Runnymede yesterday, I'd put money on the US President himself."

As Michelle Obama is visiting a Tower Hamlets school on Tuesday, seems highly likely to be hubby at Runnymede.

IanVisits | 15.06.15 - 6:47 a.m. | #

Local legend is that the Magna Carta was signed where the paddling pool now stands in the pleasure grounds.

We went to the Magna Carta celebrations in a field next to Eton yesterday, and it was a wonderful shambles in the way only local events can be. Gloriana passed through early so many missed it, then three other boats arrived half an hour later. Their landing site could only fit one boat, so rescue services ferried participants to the bank. The rest of the promised flotilla never arrived, and seems to have just stayed on the stretch downstream around Runnymede. No one was quite sure when or where the relay ceremony and re-enactments were to be held, so the one person with a megaphone had to do a lot of running around to herd the spectators. Then they couldn't get the PA system to work.

Brilliant fun.

Peter of London | 15.06.15 - 7:34 a.m. | #

I was at the Eton meadows celebration too. Only for ten minutes, but accidentally perfectly timed to see Gloriana go through and get an unobstructed riverside view. I'd seen the leading boats in the flotilla downstream shortly beforehand from the train, so knew not to hang around. All this and the relentless drizzle made for an almost memorable experience.

diamond geezer | 15.06.15 - 7:57 a.m. | #

I’m glad to learn I’m not the only one who thinks a statue of the Queen in this spot is “insane”. The fact that it’s hideous is some consolation, I suppose.

Great Aunt Annie | 15.06.15 - 9:24 a.m. | #

That statue looks more like Princess Anne than her mother. Has there been a Palace coup?

timbo | 15.06.15 - 9:53 a.m. | #

That translation has 'and' rather than the more common 'or'

or by the law of the land

http://www.bl.uk/learning/timeline/item95692.html

The 39th clause of the charter is still part of British law today. It states that: 'No free man shall be seized or imprisoned, or stripped of his rights or possessions, or outlawed or exiled, or deprived of his standing in any other way, nor will we proceed with force against him, or send others to do so, except by the lawful judgment of his equals or by the law of the land.'

Others have 'peers' but that confuses the Americans who forget 'peer review'

Mike D | 15.06.15 - 10:53 a.m. | #

Err, I always thought it was plain Magna Carta. No article, definite or otherwise.

Bronchitikat | Homepage | 15.06.15 - 11:17 a.m. | #

No Obama, as far as I am aware, but four senior royals (the Queen, Duke of Edinburgh, Duke of Cambridge, and the Princess Royal - presumably Princes Charles and George were kept elsewhere just in case, although almost all of them were on the balcony at the weekend), and the Prime Minister, the Archbishop of Canterbury, and US Attorney General Loretta Lynch.

Here is a Latin text - http://www.thelatinlibrary.com/magnacarta.html - the end of clause 39 and then clause 40 go "...nisi per legale judicium parium suorum vel per legem terre. Nulli vendemus, nulli negabimus, aut differemus rectum aut justiciam."

I think "vel" is "or" rather than "and" isn't it? But perhaps it
is a conjunctive "or".

A few bits of the 1297 reissue are still on the statute book - see http://www.legislation.gov.uk/aep/Edw1cc1929/25/9/contents - the freedom of the English Church, the ancient liberties of the City of London, and clause 39 and 40 on the rule of law.

Some people get awfully exercised about whether it has to be just plain "Magna Carta" as there is no definite article in Latin, but as we talk about it in English and we do have definite articles, I can't see that it really matters if we say "the Magna Carta" or not.

Andrew | 15.06.15 - 7:11 p.m. | #

As to the importance of Magna Carta, clearly it is important as a historic and symbolic document, but when was the last time that Magna Carta was important to the determination of a legal dispute?

To put it another way, would you rather try to rely on your rights as a "free man" ("liber homo") under Magna Carta, or perhaps something a bit more specific and meaningful under the European Convention on Human Rights?

Andrew | 15.06.15 - 7:16 p.m. | #

@Andrew: I am sure the significance of Magna Carta isn't whether it's useful today, but how it helped to develop a fairer system in England by means of law. A privilege China isn't able (and probably won't in the foreseeable future) to harness, IMHO.

Patrickov | 16.06.15 - 2:50 a.m. | #

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